Author Topic: Meet Coco and Chanel  (Read 6156 times)

Offline Judecat (Paula)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #237 on: October 12, 2018, 20:38:57 PM »
A bit left side, but quite possibly true. Surrogate affection..................
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Offline Desley (booktigger)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #236 on: October 12, 2018, 13:39:32 PM »
Had an interesting conversation with a neighbour who likes animals but not really a cat person, and she said something last night about the girls that I’m not sure I’ve considered before, I was saying about how I have always refused for them to be split up because of the bond they have, and she said that as Coco doesn’t like being touched, having Chanel around is her only way of having affection and being touched.
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Offline Desley (booktigger)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #235 on: October 11, 2018, 13:49:31 PM »
Thanks Sue, I also think Lucy picks up on my neighbours negativity and it makes her worse. Although to be fair, I have seen my neighbour try and make the effort by giving Lucy chicken, and when it runs out, Lucy has been known to hit her and draw blood! Her comment last week was that the hissing doesn’t bother her (which isn’t what she said last year!) but as she doesn’t suffer fools, it means Lucy doesn’t get any treats. I actually would go as far to say my neighbour has written Lucy off, and it is a shame she never sees her loving, affectionate side.
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Offline Sue P (Paddysmum)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #234 on: October 11, 2018, 07:11:00 AM »


That's a beautiful picture indeed.   :Luv2:

See, I can't help thinking that if your neighbour responds to Lucy's stance of protecting herself by hissing with the conclusion that Lucy is, therefore, a witch, your neighbour's attitude and response sends out a very negative energy.  It won't help the way Lucy feels towards her, and therefore becomes self-perpetuating. 

I so nearly missed the opportunity to bond with Malt when we were going through the first year of their life with us.  Every time I'd go to approach her, no matter how gently or carefully, she would run away.  This eventually muted into her standing her ground, but flinching when I went to touch her.  I almost gave up trying.  It hurt.  Hurt like hell.  I thought I was doing everything right.  Couldn't understand the constant rebuffs.  It was Malt herself who made me think twice.  I went to touch her again one morning, thinking "she'll just flinch and run away - dunno why I bother" - and of course, she did flinch and pull back.  But almost immediately, she looked at me, and took a little step towards me again.  It was like she was saying to me:  "I wasn't ready.  Not entirely.  But I want to try again.  Can we?"   And that time, when I went to touch her again, she allowed it to happen.  I kept it brief.  The next time we tried it for longer.  Eventually she would lean into the caress.

You have always worked very hard with Lucy, in attempts to make her feel more comfortable, and to earn her trust.

Your neighbour has almost written her off.  You haven't. 

I know you've said your neighbour has a lot of experience, and has cared for a lot of cats, and does a brilliant job, yet she seems unwilling to accept there are still areas where she can learn and grow.   There are always things to be learned and experienced.  Patience and perseverance can work wonders in the end.

If Lucy feels that your neighbour is negative towards her, and given her issues around people anyway, it's no surprise she's going to hiss.  SSSSSS!   :-:




Offline Misa

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #233 on: October 11, 2018, 04:07:24 AM »
WHAT A WONDERFUL PICTURE, BUTTER WOULDNT MELT LOL

Offline Desley (booktigger)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #232 on: October 10, 2018, 13:38:43 PM »
Chanel has been very purry this week, find it odd that she just lies on her own purring. She has been more playful since I got back too. I’ve attached a cute pic of her from the other day. Coco has been much better this week, still hissing, but engaging more, and she has been interested in toys, but Chanel pushes in and stops her. She does keep eyeing the door up though, which is a worry.

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Offline Sue P (Paddysmum)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #231 on: October 09, 2018, 16:23:10 PM »


I suspected as much.  :hug:  You can never assume just because a cat is "domesticated" that it doesn't have issues


Offline Desley (booktigger)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #230 on: October 09, 2018, 13:29:45 PM »
Thinking about it, I’m not sure it could – yesterday I didn’t get hissed at much, today I was hissed at a few times the first time I went in. It’s funny you should say that, it was part of our argument on Thu, she thinks that I have an issue with her having the rugrats, she couldn’t be further from the truth, if it wasn’t for her, I’d have had to find a farm home for 3 semi-feral kittens, all of which had had cat flu, and one of which has been left with a dodgy eye, luckily she lets my neighbour bathe it as soon as it starts weeping so she’s only needed one lot of eye drops in nearly 2 years, in the wild that would have been a very different matter and not sure I’d have liked that on my conscience. My main issue is her constant negativity about Lucy – Coco did hiss and pop at her while I was away, just not daily, Lucy did hiss at her daily, Coco was described as an angel, Lucy as a witch! It’s like because the rugrats and the girls had a semi-feral start it’s acceptable, but because Lucy has a domestic background she should be better behaved, but we all know that doesn’t always mean a nice, well behaved cat.
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Offline Sue P (Paddysmum)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #229 on: October 08, 2018, 14:46:01 PM »


Well, it would be good if the situation could be replicated with the same effect, and where it could be confirmed to you and potential new cat slaves (or not, as the case may be)

Sometimes, reading between the lines (and I may be well off key - if so, apologies in advance) that your neighbour can be just a teensy bit jealous of your achievements?




Offline Desley (booktigger)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #228 on: October 08, 2018, 12:26:24 PM »
Thanks Sue, I get the impression you don’t think they were that much better with my neighbour?

Had a chat with my neighbour on Sat, and her view is that yes, there is a chance she might relax more around someone else, but how are we going to find that better home? She thinks that mine is the only option for them, even if it isn’t the best, and that they are happy with restricted space due to their temperament. I had a good day with them yesterday, on Sat evening I told Coco it would be amazing if we could have one day without being hissed at – we nearly managed it, I only got hissed at one of the 6 times I went in, although she was a bit aggressive when taking treats off my hand. Had an interesting moment though, a friend came round who has seen them before, and is used to temperamental cats, she went toward them (they were both together) and Chanel hissed at her three times – I was so shocked, it takes a lot to make Chanel hiss, and I don’t think I’ve ever heard her hiss 3 times in as many minutes – and not little half hearted ones. Coco was a bit playful last night, but then Chanel kept rubbing her, so she walked away.
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Offline Sue P (Paddysmum)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #227 on: October 05, 2018, 18:54:52 PM »


Lesley, before you go doubting yourself and second-guessing the situation, can your neighbour replicate the "no hissing" for you by videoing their behaviour if you're not in the room and she is?  If it's as good as she says, the recording could also be used to help get them a new home ultimately.  If it's not that good you can stop berating yourself.   :hug:


Offline Desley (booktigger)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #226 on: October 05, 2018, 12:48:45 PM »
Thanks Paula, I do move faster than my neighbour, but if I am constantly startling her, is that fair for the rest of her life? Yesterday everytime she saw me she flew out into the catio, even at bedtime. Yes, they have improved and my neighbour said they are much more confident than when she looked after them in June. I’ve fostered all the time I’ve had Lucy, she’s just been lucky that apart from about 6 months, they have all been long term (3 months +). The girls are the ones she’s reacted to worst though, so not sure they would be her choice for permanent cats.
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Offline Judecat (Paula)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #225 on: October 04, 2018, 19:44:14 PM »
I wouldn't doubt yourself Desley, those three cats have a lovely life, Lucy is very obviously very fond of you. Maybe you move more quickly than your neighbour? Then you may startle her, making her hiss? Compared to what you were telling us about Coco and Chanel when they first came to you, you have made great strides. Lucy invites fusses etc. on her own terms, I'd say you were doing well with all three. If Lucy were to be an 'only' cat you wouldn't be able to foster anyway and I am sure that it is better to have long term/permanent cats than a succession of fosters for her to get her head around is better for her. :hug: :hug: :hug:
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Offline Desley (booktigger)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #224 on: October 04, 2018, 13:18:35 PM »
I hadn’t realised it took so long to touch Sasa Gill. The catio is a good investment. I’ve been thinking about the girls while I’ve been away, as I’ve had them a year now, I was 95% sure about keeping them because I wasn’t sure they would adjust to new surroundings/people, just torn that I had promised Lucy that she would always be an only cat, but got home and my neighbour said she hadn’t been hissed at every day while I was away, yet I do, which has made me wonder if mine really is the best home for them – surely if she gets hissed at less than me, then Coco does have an issue with me, and she might settle better with someone else? She thinks I’m wrong, and said they are much more relaxed than when she looked after them overnight in June, but I’ve been hissed and growled at since getting back, although Chanel has just been her normal curious self.
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Offline Misa

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #223 on: October 02, 2018, 20:25:10 PM »
IT TOOK MANY YEARS BEFORE SASA WOULD LET ME TOUCH HER BUT I COULD ALWAYS SEE SHE REALLY WANTED TO BE STROKED BUT JUST COULD NOT LET IT HAPPEN

SOME SEVEN YEARS ON SHE EVENTUALLY LET ME STROKE HER HEAD AND THEN THE PURRS AND AFFECTION WERE WONDERFUL

YES THE CATIO ETC MUST HAVE COST A LOT BUT A GREAT INVESTMENT FOR THESE TWO SHY LADIES

Offline Desley (booktigger)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #222 on: September 25, 2018, 13:33:10 PM »
The irony really Gill is that between the catio and all the new toys they’ve had, they’ve cost a lot already this year, so I’m not going to get them a very expensive bed! Chanel has gone back to sitting on the cabinet when I am on the chair, I just wish she would let me touch her, but unless she thinks you are going to do that, she does look very relaxed.
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Offline Misa

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #221 on: September 24, 2018, 16:57:21 PM »
OMG THE C WORD

YES I AM SURE THEY WOULD LOVE SOME NICE PRESENT AND THEY ARE WORMING THEIR WAY INTO YOUR HEART AS CATS DO

Offline Desley (booktigger)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #220 on: September 22, 2018, 16:50:14 PM »
Well, I must be coming round to the idea of them staying, I was thinking the other day that Lucy could do with a new heated bed, so thought I'd get her one for Christmas, then it dawned on me I should buy something for the girls for Christmas too! Going to get them a new bed, the igloo bed they don't use is new, the 3 they do use have been bought for previous cats, so it would be nice for them to have something of their own, and going to get Chanel a kickeroo. Mind you, they are going to get a new toy from my holiday too, the local hedgehog society do hand knitted catnip hedgehogs that they sell in a local pet shop, although they aren't that fussed with catnip. I just can't shake off that niggle, don't know if it is the thought of keeping them confined, or needing to adjust to the fact that I can't foster anymore
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Offline Desley (booktigger)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #219 on: September 21, 2018, 13:23:03 PM »
Yes, I suppose you are right Sue, and I suppose the important thing is that they seem happy. There was an article in the PAH newsletter about various types of toys to give kittens for stimulation, Chanel has all bar one, and that one she has had and I gave away as she didn’t use it!
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Offline Misa

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #218 on: September 20, 2018, 18:10:51 PM »
YUP ME TOO

Offline dawnf

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #217 on: September 20, 2018, 14:33:37 PM »
I Like that!

Offline Sue P (Paddysmum)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #216 on: September 20, 2018, 13:54:46 PM »


There was a modern day fable about a god-fearing and respectful elderly couple, who always believed that God would provide.

When the storm warnings came, the skies grew dark and the rain fell, they knew that come what may, God Would Provide.

As the waters rose, and the lands flooded, the couple had to move to the upstairs of their house.  The Lifeboat came and tried to persuade the couple to leave, bu they refused, saying "God Would Provide."

When the waters rose higher, and the couple had to move to the rooftop, the rescue helicopter hovered overhead and beseeched them to leave, but the couple refused, saying resolutely "God Will Provide."

The waters rose higher still, and claimed the lives of the old couple.  As they got to the Pearly Gates, they looked at Saint Peter and asked, bewildered:  "What happened?  We always prayed, we always believed and knew God Would Provide, but in our hour of need, he failed us.  Why?"

St Peter scratched his beard thoughtfully, and said, "Well now, he sent a lifeboat crew and a helicopter - what more did you expect?"

In many ways Desley, you ARE the Lifeboat Crew and the Helicopter, so far as Coco and Chanel are concerned......


« Last Edit: September 20, 2018, 13:56:00 PM by Sue P (Paddysmum) »

Offline Sue P (Paddysmum)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #215 on: September 20, 2018, 13:50:00 PM »



The key point there being the whole of your last sentence.   :hug:



Offline Desley (booktigger)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #214 on: September 20, 2018, 13:10:24 PM »
Yeah, still doesn’t stop my niggle of not being to help others though. But then Lucy is also part of that problem, when I had Buster I could put cats in the bathroom on a temporary basis, but Lucy can’t deal with change very well, plus her weeing habits! Not sure I’d go as far as love Gill, but they are interacting well. I do think I need to stop thinking that something better might come up, they trust me and might not transfer that well, and it’s certainly better than Chanel has ever had, possibly better than Coco has ever had.
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Offline Misa

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #213 on: September 19, 2018, 16:33:13 PM »
SO AGREE WITH SUE AND THEY LOVE THEIR ENVIRONMENT AND SECRETLY YOU DESLEY LOL EVEN IF YOU DONT THINK SO AT TIMES

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #212 on: September 19, 2018, 13:27:34 PM »
I have had the time to devote to them and that the charity haven't forced the issue due to the large number of cats needing help, CP have a 6 month rule with cats, partly to stop the cats being frustrated with an environment (which I get if you have cats in pens). Mine are lucky that I've been able to do so much to enrich that for them.

Ain't that the truth!!   ;D  And that's why sometimes, with fostering as with all else to do with cats, you have to tear up the rulebook, and do what works best for the individual cat.  Sometimes, what works best, bucks the trend. [/ size]

Offline Desley (booktigger)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #211 on: September 19, 2018, 13:19:26 PM »
Not in that picture, although they do still act like it at times! Their behaviour may be challenging, but I don't find them hard work, probably because I see hissing in my house as a term of endearment, it's a daily occurrence, and that's just from Lucy! Yes, when discussing it with my neighbour, I said that you can't always go off the textbook situation. I am lucky that volunteering for an independent charity, I have had the time to devote to them and that the charity haven't forced the issue due to the large number of cats needing help, CP have a 6 month rule with cats, partly to stop the cats being frustrated with an environment (which I get if you have cats in pens). Mine are lucky that I've been able to do so much to enrich that for them.
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Offline Sue P (Paddysmum)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #210 on: September 19, 2018, 13:11:00 PM »


No, they don't look like scared semi-ferals.  Some of their behaviour may be challenging, but somehow I don't get the feeling they'd have done better living on a farm for example.  I think your patience and hard work is paying dividends. 

Maybe professionals get hung up on the textbook situation, and don't have the time to devote to alternatives, hence their view being rather slanted in one direction or another. 



Offline Desley (booktigger)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #209 on: September 19, 2018, 13:07:32 PM »
I showed the vet the pic of the catio last night, she said that they should have been TNR’d last year, so I showed her the pic of Coco looking relaxed, and said ‘maybe, however she doesn’t look like a stressed semi-feral and if you asked them now, they’d not want to give up 3 meals a day, numerous beds and a radiator’, which she had to agree with, then asked if I had accepted they weren’t going anywhere yet, so I said they are still long term fosters, just in case. Although if I’m honest, the longer they are here, the less fair it would be to them to be moved. Had a nightmare getting them in last night, I walked out a couple of times, went back in once and Coco had just come in, so took one look at me and went back out, but the weather was getting bad, so I tried to force the issue, she was a bit wary of me when I went in at bedtime, but did eventually accept taking treats off me.
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Offline Desley (booktigger)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #208 on: September 15, 2018, 15:25:08 PM »
Was naughty today, and tried to stroke Chanel as she'd got in a corner to get away from me cleaning, she immediately went to mum for some reassurance, so had a popping Coco when I tried to give Chanel a treat for scaring her! Left them for a bit, and have just come in, they were both in the enclosure, Chanel was on the floor, so I kneeled down so I was eye level with her, and they both seemed curious enough to come and sniff, was the closest I've got to Coco, they seemed surprised by the window, but obviously there was safety for Coco as I couldn't get to her. Am glad they didn't hold a grudge after the earlier incident.
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Offline Desley (booktigger)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #207 on: September 14, 2018, 12:50:16 PM »
That is very true Sue. It's ironic I get so bothered by them having been in that room nearly a year, but some of my own cats have chosen to live in one room (although with hindsight, some of those were due to letting foster cats have the run of the house), some never went downstairs, some never went upstairs! Unfortunately Gill it is only Chanel who responds to dreamies, and I can't get into the catio with them!
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Offline Sue P (Paddysmum)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #206 on: September 14, 2018, 07:28:34 AM »
Good to see her looking so relaxed

Offline Misa

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #205 on: September 14, 2018, 02:45:19 AM »
I AM NOT SURPRISED SHE LOOKS GORGEOUS WITH THOSE STUNNING BLUE EYES. SHE LOOKS SO COMFORTABLE AND RIGHT AT HOME

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #204 on: September 13, 2018, 21:46:04 PM »
will reply tomorrow, but think this is one of my favourite pics of coco
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Offline Misa

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #203 on: September 13, 2018, 14:28:05 PM »
AM AMAZED HOW GREAT THEY ARE DOING BUT CATS LEARN VERY QUICKLY HOW OUT OF REACH FROM A HUMAN CAN BE CHALLENGING FOR THE HUMAN SO PLEASED THEY REACT TO DREAMIEST.  OTHERWISE YOU WILL NEED TO GET INTO THE CATIO DESLEY........GREAT PICS TO SEE NEW CAT DESLEY LOL

Offline Sue P (Paddysmum)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #202 on: September 13, 2018, 13:49:29 PM »


I think we often try to second guess what we would want in an ideal life if we were cats, against what our cats want. 

Sometimes for cats, simplicity is key.  Coco and Chanel seem to be quite happy with their smaller, but less threatening environment, and I'd agree the confined space is why they're doing well.  And from a welfare point of view, a happy cat is a healthier cat as a result.

I spotted a Youtube video yesterday about a woman who took in a young cat that was born without its hind legs.   It was foraging for food in very poor weather and was in quite a miserable way of things.  She adopted it, and took it to the vet who said she was wasting her time and it should be put to sleep.  She saw something in the little lad that she wanted to give every chance.

A year on, and that cat was zooming about her house, playful and thoroughly enjoying life with two other cats in her home.  It didn't hold back, it didn't realise it was handicapped.  It was living life as a cat - confident tail held high, and joining in with life 110%.

You've given that opportunity to the girls, and they're responding to it.  I wouldn't get too hung up on what the textbook welfare situation is.  I think it has to match the cat's needs and wants, and seems to me like you're doing fine in that regard.   :hug:



Offline Desley (booktigger)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #201 on: September 13, 2018, 12:41:45 PM »
Yes, I was really proud of them even though it wasn’t great sitting there in the cold while Chanel was acting like a yo-yo! She really didn’t want to go back in, and was surprised when she asked to go out before breakfast this morning, that’s a first. It’s like something twigged in her head. The irony is I think being in a confined space is why they are doing as well, even if that isn’t ideal from a welfare point of view. Wondering if it is worth getting some hairball biscuits for Chanel, any thoughts on if they are worth it or not? I have realised she isn’t sitting on the cabinet to sniff me as much.

Had a nightmare with them last night, I had a committee meeting and Chanel was in the catio when I left, so I left it open and didn’t get back till after 9, it took until 9.50 to get them to come in, Coco was on the top shelf when I got in, so I went and got changed, went back in and she was on the bottom shelf, then went on the floor and just didn’t want to come in, Chanel happily came in when I got the Dreamies out, but I think it took 20 mins for Coco to come in. Then Chanel tried 3 times to get back out!! Must post a pic later of Coco looking so relaxed in her bed.
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Offline Judecat (Paula)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #200 on: September 12, 2018, 18:40:59 PM »
It may have taken a bit of getting used to but I'd say the catio is a success. :)
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Offline dawnf

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #199 on: September 12, 2018, 15:55:06 PM »
that is good news, they are coming on so well

Offline Sue P (Paddysmum)

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Re: Meet Coco and Chanel
« Reply #198 on: September 12, 2018, 15:00:40 PM »


That's such brilliant news Desley.  You must be quite proud of them both.  A good move on your part.  It's really enriching their experience.  ;D


 


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