Pupil sometimes larger/smaller than other but not often

[oscy]

Ooo took me a while to reply, I didn't see the whole of moiramassey's post. Anyway I haven't see the pupil change since then, just now there might've been a little but only at a certain angle and spot of the room, so it seems it may mostly be an illusion.

For now I'm happy with not doing any more as there hasn't been any sign of it since!

[moiramassey]

Sorry! 

Apologies for stereotyping.

And so I wonder, I've talked to the vet and I'm told he should be taken to one physically to be sure by most posters (not just here). I'll then take him to the vet to get his eyes checked, post back saying s/he doesn't see anything wrong then posters will say "get a second opinion, just to be sure". I'll do that then post back saying no problems then it'll be "take him to a specialist, just to be sure" and so on and so on.

I can see how you might be left with that impression, because you did the sensible thing and talked with your vet over the phone but were then told by many posters that they would not settle for that and would have wanted their vet to see the cat. The standard response on any responsible cat forum is that any worries you have should always be followed up by a consultation with a vet. I think the discussion is really whether a phone consultation is enough.

The only important question is, was it enough for you? Are you convinced that what you see is a scientific curiosity or are you still worried that it is a symptom?

If you are worried, find out how much it would be to take the kitten to the vet. My vet would only charge a one-quarter consultation fee to check the pupil response, the grand total of £6.50. Unfortunately, most vets are much more pricey than mine, or don't work in less than whole consultations.

You also might be right in that there may be the odd suggestion about getting a second opinion  . Some people worry more than others.

[Susanne (urbantigers)]

I'm only concerned because I've posted on a few other forums too and the general consensus is "the vet said this, but we think the vet's wrong" yet when I took this stance in one forum, it got locked cos their 'disclaimer' stated that other posters aren't vets and aren't right some of the time.

The bottom line is that none of us are vets and although online forums can be useful, they can also be potentially dangerous.  None of us can say what is wrong with your cat, if anything.  We can give accounts of our own experiences, but we cannot say whether your cat having one pupil smaller than the other is indicative of anything that would require further investigation or not.  If you're happy with talking to the vet over the phone, then so be it.  I would recommend a trip to the vet as an actual examination would allow the vet to check it out properly.  The vet can shine a light in his eyes and note the pupil response.  In conjunction with a complete examination, the vet is then in a position to say whether s/he thinks further investigations (and/or a specialist) are necessary or whether it's nothing to worry about.  It seems that the condition you describe could be perfectly normal but is also a symptom of some conditions.  The only way to find out for sure which it is, is to allow the vet to examine the cat.  I don't know your vet or how confident you are in your vet's opinion without seeing your cat.   Whether you take this any further is up to you and your mum, but imo you have been given sensible advice on here.  It's now up to you to decide what to do next, if anything. 

[Gillian Harvey]

And so I wonder, I've talked to the vet and I'm told he should be taken to one physically to be sure by most posters (not just here). I'll then take him to the vet to get his eyes checked, post back saying s/he doesn't see anything wrong then posters will say "get a second opinion, just to be sure". I'll do that then post back saying no problems then it'll be "take him to a specialist, just to be sure" and so on and so on.

Well it seems like you don't need our opinions here or anywhere else then. I'd just say you've got a lot of sensible advice here - its up to you and your mum what you do with I guess. 

[oscy]

If it was me, I'd want to get this checked out by a vet to be on the safe side.  You're obviously concerned about it otherwise you wouldnt' have posted in the first place and you wouldnt' have rang the vet.  If you're happy with what the vet told you on the phone then fine, but you do still seem to be a bit concerned about it.

I'm only concerned because I've posted on a few other forums too and the general consensus is "the vet said this, but we think the vet's wrong" yet when I took this stance in one forum, it got locked cos their 'disclaimer' stated that other posters aren't vets and aren't right some of the time.

And so I wonder, I've talked to the vet and I'm told he should be taken to one physically to be sure by most posters (not just here). I'll then take him to the vet to get his eyes checked, post back saying s/he doesn't see anything wrong then posters will say "get a second opinion, just to be sure". I'll do that then post back saying no problems then it'll be "take him to a specialist, just to be sure" and so on and so on.

Can I ask, if your mum isn't prepared to pay the costs to get this little guys eye checked; couldn't you?

Yea, although the money is needed for education I can, my mum said I had to pay if he was going to the vet and I was going to but then I called the vet first.

In my online research I found this....

http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=1043528, "Inequality of the direct and consensual light reflexes in normal subjects" which is a study in humans about whether the direct stimulus and the consensual reflex are always the same and say at the end of the summary that IT IS CONCLUDED THAT, CONTRARY TO PREVIOUS OPINION, A SMALL DEGREE OF CONTRACTION ANISOCORIA IS NORMAL. (Their captitals, not mine.)

So maybe you are just unusually observant!

Nice find. The measurement numbers seem a bit low though, unless it is an illusion thing too making it seem even bigger.

I do not think it is the poster who is making the decisions, but her mum

If I'm a 'her', I'm very hairy for my gender.

[moiramassey]

If you think the kitten has has this feature for months (possible since birth) and he was neutered during that time I am sure that the vet would have tested his pupil reflexes and would have said if something was wrong.

Thanks for making me look up the pupil reflex, so I have now learned about the 'Direct And Consensual Pupil Reflex', with the 'consenual' bit being that when you shine a light in one eye the other one contracts.

In my online research I found this....

http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=1043528, "Inequality of the direct and consensual light reflexes in normal subjects" which is a study in humans about whether the direct stimulus and the consensual reflex are always the same and say at the end of the summary that IT IS CONCLUDED THAT, CONTRARY TO PREVIOUS OPINION, A SMALL DEGREE OF CONTRACTION ANISOCORIA IS NORMAL. (Their captitals, not mine.)

So maybe you are just unusually observant!

I understand what Susanne is saying about the insurance, but as, in this case, I do not think it is the poster who is making the decisions, but her mum, I am not sure if this is the place to have the discussion.

[JackSpratt]

Can I ask, if your mum isn't prepared to pay the costs to get this little guys eye checked; couldn't you?

One of my cats had an issue with one pupil being larger than the other - it was because she'd been bopped accidentally in the eye by one of the others when he'd forgotten to sheath his claw! The result did require a course of (inexpensive) eye ointment for about three weeks.

Just a suggestion. You seem pretty clued up on things so I'm assuming you'd rather be safe than sorry.

[Susanne (urbantigers)]

If it was me, I'd want to get this checked out by a vet to be on the safe side.  You're obviously concerned about it otherwise you wouldnt' have posted in the first place and you wouldnt' have rang the vet.  If you're happy with what the vet told you on the phone then fine, but you do still seem to be a bit concerned about it.  You mention he's about 6 months - has he been neutered yet?  If not, that might be a good time to get the eye checked out too.  I would say it can wait until you have a routine appt at the vet, but I wouldn't personally want to leave it too long before getting it checked out.  It may be nothing sinister or it may be indicative of something more serious.  Only a vet examination can determine that.

re insurance - it's up to the individual as to whether or not they want to take out insurance, but I do worry a bit when people say they don't want it because it is too expensive.  If you can pay on the spot that's fine, or set up a savings account for vet treatment, but please don't estimate future vet costs based on what you have paid in the past.  You seem to have been very lucky so far.  Vet treatment can easily run into hundreds or thousands of pounds.   Blood tests, x-rays, dental treatment, RTAs... all happen to cats and can cost hundreds to sort out.  When one of my cats died from a thrombosis 3 years ago, the vet treatment came to nearly £2000 and he was only at the vets for a few hours.   Not taking him to the vet was not an option as he was lying on the floor unable to move.  One of my boys swallowed some string from a cat toy last year and had to have an emergency operaton - cost of £450.  If you can pay that kind of money on the spot, that's great.  If you know you will be able to get your hands on that sort of money in an emergency (eg borrowing from family, putting it on a credit card) then that's fine too.  But it's important to think ahead and be prepared for what may happen.  As long as you're happy that you have thought about it and have worked out a way of paying for treatment, or have accepted that you may need to refuse treatment on grounds of cost (and maybe have a cat pts without attempting treatment) and can live with the decision you've made, then no-one can do more than that.  It just worries me when people (talking generally now, not specificially about the OP here) think they don't need insurance because they think that their cat will never get ill and never need much vet treatment.

[oscy]

When your Mum says, 'its the light' she may have a point. Pupil contraction and dilation is a reflex. If more light is falling on one eye that the other, then this may be the cause.

This is said a lot, but from what I know the reflex happens to both eyes at the same time. So if you shone a very bright light solely on one eye, the other eye's pupil would still contract.

Are you sure it is always the same eye? I am looking at the photo and there is more light in the photo on the side where the pupil is smaller.

There are other photos, it seems to always be the right eye which is bigger (when it happens)

He's been neutered so has no vet visits plan, it was a while ago though. There's another pic of him even younger, perhaps before neutering, where one eye seems bigger than the other.

I'm starting to wonder if it's an illusion, but can't figure out how.

And thanks. 

[moiramassey]

OK, I know I am late to this one, but the online query that Mark has referred to says one pupil is MUCH bigger than the other and that, also, this was a sudden change. In this case the difference isn't that much and the eyes appear to be reacting normally to light. You said that they both dilate and contract. You said they both contract down to the same size.

When your Mum says, 'its the light' she may have a point. Pupil contraction and dilation is a reflex. If more light is falling on one eye that the other, then this may be the cause. Are you sure it is always the same eye? I am looking at the photo and there is more light in the photo on the side where the pupil is smaller.

Even if it is, it does not mean that there is anything wrong. Your cat could have been born with one eye very slightly different to the other.

You rang your vet and told him/she about it. S/he said s/he did not think it was a worry. It sounds to me as if you tested the cat's pupil reflex and explained it to the vet. As the reflex in both eyes seemed normal, the vet is not worried.

When is the little guy due a vet visit? Has he been neutered yet? If he hasn't, you could ask the vet to look at his eyes carefully when he goes in for neutering. If he has been neutered in the last month or so, I am sure the vet would have noticed if there was something wrong.
 
The insurance thing is really noone else's business but your mum's. I have had cats for many years without insurance. I paid when there was a bill to pay, like your mum. When you have lots of pets insurance payments can really mount up. I have a reasonably priced vet, so, on balance, that was the better choice for me.

Your cat looks really cute!

[Mark]

I really can't imagine any vet saying that without seeing the cat. Here is an article saying it can be anythingthing from side-effects of medications to a brain tumour.

http://en.allexperts.com/q/Ask-Veterinarian-700/Cat-enlarged-pupil.htm

If it were any of mine, they would have been taken to the vet at the first sign. I would think about changing vets if it was me.

[oscy]

But apparently it's normal.

[Gillian Harvey]

If it was me I'd want to get it checked out by the vet - in person, not over the phone.

[oscy]

I described the situation, so it was about pupils.

[Millys Mum]

Hi, I rang the vet about it and got a call back after one had been consulted and I was told it's normal for cats to sometimes have odd eyes.

They may be talking about colours, pupils should be the same

PDSA - peoples dispensary for sick animals i think. I believe that you need to be pre registered with them before the animal gets ill tho 

[oscy]

My neighbours cat had had an orange spot on his eye for years, and our vet didn't think there was anything unusual

Was this over the phone or in person?

[Desley (booktigger)]

The thing with the vets advice is that they haven't seen the cat, so it can be hard to make that kind of call. My neighbours cat had had an orange spot on his eye for years, and our vet didn't think there was anything unusual - he had to go to a specialist for a throat problem, where they picked up on the fact it was actually cancerous. Poor cat only has one eye now.

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

PDSA will only see animals if the owner is on benefits, so maybe will not apply to you.

[oscy]

What's PDSA?

So if the vet says it's ok, s/he might be wrong?

[Mark]

I agree - if you can't get your mum to pay, maybe there is a PDSA clinic who would take a look and advise. There is obviously something wrong. I have never seen a cat with different size pupils. It could be something neurological.

[Sam (Fussy_Furball)]

It seems very strange that one pupil is reacting differently to the other ... I understand what you are saying about insurance (it's a personal thing and if you don't want to insure that is entirely upto you).  I would however recommend taking your little kitty to vet and ask them to check his eyes just for peace of mind. .... please xxx

[Kittybabe (Ruth)]

Very lucky indeed. THough I would never say never. I never anticipated Lexy would tumble of a chair dislocating her knee, requiring extensive surgery which ran into nearly £3000. I never anticipated she would get acute cystitis causing bladder stones which needed to be surgically removed, running into over £2000.. without insurance which cost me less than £10 a month I'd never have managed.

Its better to spend £120 a year for peace of mind. If I couldn't afford that, I'd probably not have a cat as I'd not be able to afford her food and care either.

[Desley (booktigger)]

All I can say is your mum is very lucky - my vets bills for the last two years have been just over £1k a year, and the bulk of that has been on one cat, although admittedly Tiger wouldnt have seen the specialist if she hadn't been insured. Insurance for a young cat is around £5 per month.

[oscy]

What happens if your cat has a serious accident and loses a leg or needs a tail amputing?

Then pay on the spot. My mum has had around 11 pets and none have needed anything like that. The biggest thing has been removing lumps but compared with the long lives and amount of pets, it's money saved not insuring rather than money lost.

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

What happens if your cat has a serious accident and loses a leg or needs a tail amputing?

Insurance is what it says, insurance against having to pay a great amount of money out and in my opinion absolutely essential.

Once you know an animal has a problem , nobody will insure it for that problem so safest way is to take out insurance as soon as a new cat arrives.

[Millys Mum]

Its something worth considering if a consult for an eye is too much.
Worse case scenario is it could be the starting signs of neurological problems which to diagnose uses alot of high tech expensive machines.

[oscy]

Insurance is far too expensive I'm afraid, let alone for covering what could be very healthy cats. I'd imagine the amount of money spend on medication etc. by my mum on the pets she's had is vastly lower than if she had paid insurance for all of them first.

[Millys Mum]

They can have odd coloured eyes but pupils should react the same.

Its also a good idea to get your cat insured for any future ailments 

[oscy]

Hi, I rang the vet about it and got a call back after one had been consulted and I was told it's normal for cats to sometimes have odd eyes.

But that worries me, why is it normal if I'm getting all this talk of leukemia, brain tumours and ear mites from others?

[Kittybabe (Ruth)]

As both pupils  in normal circumstances will expand and contract, when only one does that could mean something as small as a mild inflamation of the eye or something more serious like a malfunction of the retinal muscle. Either way, your cat should be seen by a vet to at least eliminate something more serious.

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

I think you should definately at least speak to a vet , who may then want to see him

[oscy]

I have a black kitten who's 6 months old. He's a 'normal' cat, but sometimes, not often but I notice perhaps once every few days, he has one pupil larger than the other. I've looked losely and tried different amounts of light on different eyes and don't see anything wrong.

They dilate and contract normally and to the same size. It's an odd thing. I took photos on my phone one night when it showed up so I''m not imagining it. There's a slightly older photo of it as well so it's been a month or two:



My mum won't take him to the vet saying it's "just the light", whatever that means, and also cos of money.

What do you think?

Thanks.