Purrs In Our Hearts - Cat Forum UK
Cat Rescue & Rehoming => Cat/s Needing Homes => Sorted/ Unknown outcomes => Topic started by: solar on June 03, 2011, 17:35:37 PM
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Hi,
I'm in a bit of a state at the moment as we took a stray cat into the vet on Wednesday as his ears were looking sore. We have been feeding him whenever we've seen him for 2 years and checking he is well. The vet treated him, kept him in overnight and transferred him to the RSPCA yesterday. We just rang up to check he is settling in and they've told us he has tested FIV+ and they have threatened to PTS! I now feel I've done the wrong thing for such a sweet and friendly cat. I'll do anything to save this lovely cat but I don't know how to save him or how long he has. We plan to go in when they open tomorrow and ask if we can give him a temporary home until we find something permanent but we have our own cat to consider and we're not sure of the chances of them releasing him to us when we have a FIV- cat. I am assuming we have until Wednesday when the 7 days are up to rescue him before PTS but I don't know for sure, I just want to get him out to safety.
What is the best way to help him?
Thanks
Solar
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Hi
Sorry that you have had to find out about this organisation's policy to pts after 7 days and also their automatic pts of FIV+ cats.
I ( like many others) have been involved before in trying to stop them pts cats after 7 days and with the help of rescues and people on forums like this we have managed at the 11th hour to get the cat released to the original finder.
When they are saying the cat has tested FIV+ positive, this may be based on an in- house snap test which are not considered the most reliable. Bloods should be sent away for lab testing. I am not sure whether they would release an potential FIV+ positive cat to you but perhaps all avenues have to be explored - FIV+ friendly rescues, peeps that already have FIV+ cats etc.
I personally would class this as an urgent case (don't know if mods would consider moving to urgent section and perhaps renaming the Subject FIV+ cat RSPCA PTS date 8 June ).
So the cat has until next wednesday. What is the location of the cat and have you the reference no. so peeps can see if they can help?
Would also consider posting this on Cat Chat if you have not already.
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Definately an urgent case and will move.
I just hate them with a passion.
I just dont understand why the vet moved the cat to RSPCA, did you ask him to do this?
The last one we heard of only a couple of weeks ago was a dog, well a puppy and he was pts by them.
Please can you amend the title.......first and your last post,,,,,,,,to add on necessary info
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Hi Edd,
Thanks for your quick reply. The date for PTS isn't certain - I'll change this in the subject title when I know, their exact words were “The cat is fine within himself, but he has tested positive for FIV so he will need to be put to sleep unfortunately if we cannot find him a home”. It was very difficult to hold a conversation with them due a noisy phone line and they were just closing so we plan to go and talk to them in person as soon as they open tomorrow to get more details (including the reference number). I'm thinking Wednesday is the worst case scenario based on other branches policy I've read about - the 7 days, which is why I'd like to get him out before then. I'm in Devon, I'll update more info and post the reference number tomorrow.
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Thanks
The cases I have been involved with are cats handed into the hospitals although am aware that branches also have this unnecessary approach to pts FIV+ cats >:( but some don't and try to find suitable homes for them.
Please let us know how you get on tomorrow and thank you for caring for this little one :hug:
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Hi Gill,
The vet said they would keep him in overnight after treating him and transfer him to a rescue centre (either CPL or RSPCA) the following day as he had no chip. I didn't realise any decisions would be taken out of our hands like this, at the time I was just thankful he was being treated and cared for.
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Hi Edd,
I don't want to name and shame the particular branch until I'm sure we have all the facts right tomorrow, then I'll update the thread. Thanks for the support :thanks:
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Good luck tomorrow.
Nicky
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Hi Edd,
I don't want to name and shame the particular branch until I'm sure we have all the facts right tomorrow, then I'll update the thread. Thanks for the support :thanks:
Totally understand :hug: Good luck tomorrow :hug:
You might want to check with them what FIV/Felv test was undertaken when speaking with them - ie snap inhouse test or sent away to a lab.
This website has some useful info:
http://www.gla.ac.uk/faculties/vet/cad/informationforowners/felineimmunodeficiencyvirusfiv/
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Best case scenario is to explain the situation to a friend and get them to go along to the RSPCA looking for a single indoor cat. it may be the only way to get the cat out again.....
once he's safe then you can decide what best to do with him.
or you can threaten bad publicity with the rspca and they may back down and let you have him back.
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Please also check out the info on the Catworks site - they are very experienced with FIV+ cats and there are many stories on there of FIV+ and FIV- cats living together without the virus being passed on. So you can arm yourself with the facts and assure RSPCA you know what your are taking on (if you decide to have him back with you) :hug: http://www.v63.net/catsanctuary/fiv.html
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Just wanted to wish you luck and echo the excellent advice given by peeps here. It just makes me so angry, their attitude sucks. We have rehomed quite a few FIV+ cats and indeed have 3 in at the moment, all gorgeous healthy cats. They take a bit longer to rehome but we always manage in the end.
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I am very sorry and shocked to read this - good luck tomorrow
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Wishing you lots of luck tomorrow :hug: :hug:
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I don't have any practiocal advice, just wanted to say good on you for trying to help this boy and good luck for tomorrow. Please let us know how you get on :hug:
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Firstly let Me just say .....I HATE RSPCA
I don;t understand why the vet got them involved, it wasn't their right to do that as YOU took the cat in to have his ears looked at !
Did you at anytime say you didn't want him ?
Is he neutered by the way ?
I can't tell you to lie and tell them you haven't got another cat *ahem*
How does your cat react to this one ?
I had one FIV positive cat living with 10 cat NON fiv cats so it so possible
Good luck xxx
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Good luck for tomorrow.
I have 2 FIV+ and 4 FIV- cats who live together quite happily, so as Michelle says, it is possible, although I have no idea how easy it would be to persuade the RSPCA about this.
Obviously it is very important that this kitty is neutered.
I noticed that you said that he is a "sweet and friendly cat", so it is possible that he gets on with your cat?
I don't know if you have read the Cat Chat FIV Information page yet (http://www.catchat.org/fiv.html (http://www.catchat.org/fiv.html)), but together with a lot of other useful information it states:
Can FIV-positives and FIV-negatives live together?
The most recent research carried out at Glasgow University's Companion Animal Diagnostics indicates that the chances of FIV being passed from one cat to another in the same household is approx 1-2%. This means that if you have 100 cats (!) in a house with 1 FIV positive cat, only 1 or 2 could be expected to become infected. Even when FIV was passed on, as in the Glasgow survey, none of the cats actually died of it. In another survey a few years ago FIV was not passed from cat to cat in the same household at all.
The Celia Hammond Animal Trust have been conducting a long-term study at their sanctuary since the late 1990's, where FIV-positive and FIV-negative cats live happily together, grooming each other and sharing food bowls and litter trays. Regular blood tests for the virus are carried out, and to date no cases of transmission have yet been found.
There seems no reason, therefore, not to have FIV positive and negative cats in the same household, provided they are not fighters. If two cats in one household fight, they should be kept apart, given behavioural therapy or one re-homed, regardless of their FIV status. So, this is obviously a decision to be taken on a case by case basis, depending on the natures of the cats involved.
I'm not sure if this is of any help at all, but if you can get this kitty away from the RSPCA, even if only temporarily until a safer place can be found for him, then please please do.
Again, best of luck :hug:
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Thanks for all the information you have given me and for the messages of support :thanks: . We didn't manage to bring him home today :'( though we did give him a lot of fuss. The manager does seem to want to do the best for him even though we have differing views on FIV and he wants to get a full report from the vet on Wednesday to make sure we are both fully informed about his health and to find out if there are any underlying illnesses. We are hoping for a positive outcome after the vet's assessment as if there is no claim of ownership we consider ourselves his owners.
He has promised that the cat will be safe and not PTS before we discuss his future again on Wednesday, I hope we have convinced him that FIV is not a good enough reason in itself to end any cat's life and that if he is otherwise healthy he may have many more years of happiness ahead. He doesn't appear to be in any pain or distress so I don't think PTS should be an option at all. I'm shocked that anyone thinks it is the right thing to do. It seems there was a misunderstanding at the vets and he shouldn't have ended up at the shelter, the vet must have assumed we didn't want to care for him. Now he is at the shelter, the manager feels he has a duty of care to the cat and won't release him until he is in full possession of the facts.
As for our little friend, he was his usual friendly self, pleased to see us despite what we've put him through. They believe he is around 8 years old and is entire and so our first step would be to neuter and make sure he is warm, safe and well fed in his own room at home which we have prepared for him.
We will keep you updated, thanks again everyone :hug:
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Thank you for caring for this little lad and fingers crossed he will be realsed back into your care soon :hug:
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We had 37 normals cats and 2 FIV+ ferals who all lived topgether with no transference, sadly FIV did take hissy Holly and Sailor but they had long lives and were happy
We now have 52 cats and 2 dogs and a puppy living happily together - we have no tailed, 3 legged, heart murmers ferals who can give Bengal tigers a run for their money and the ones who couldn't cope in a normal family home all live here happily and are allowed to be all they can be ;D
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Glad you were able to speak with the manager at the shelter and you were able to make it clear to them that you are looking out for this little guy.
Do let us know how you get on and hope he can be released back to you. :hug:
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Hope you get him home soon. He sounds lovely!
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Bless you for caring for this little FIV boy. I have both FIV+ and FIV- in my gang. The eldest FIV+ is 14+ and going strong. They can live long and normal lives. Perfect as indoor cats for people in flats but also can be outside but restricted to property by cat proof fencing. There is absolutely no need to pts and I sincerely hope you can persuade the RSPCA to release him to you. I would be happy to cross post on the Catchat FIV Forum for you.
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So pleased you have spoken with the manager and do hope the cat is released to you, if there is a problem then I think it will be an urgent requirement for all members of this forum to bombard the branch in question with emails and or phone calls.
If you can post on Cat Chat too that will be great too and am sure those on FB would put this up too.
WE must save this cat and thank you for going for it :hug: :hug: :hug:
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It's so great that you are willing to fight for this little chap ;D
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So pleased you have spoken with the manager and do hope the cat is released to you, if there is a problem then I think it will be an urgent requirement for all members of this forum to bombard the branch in question with emails and or phone calls.
If you can post on Cat Chat too that will be great too and am sure those on FB would put this up too.
WE must save this cat and thank you for going for it :hug: :hug: :hug:
Agree 100%. It makes me so mad that the local branch of RSPCA have passed me up twice for an indoor only adult (no home check), when other branches are PTS healthy cats. >:( How hard would it be to set up a similar system to that which the Oxfam website has for selling collectibles (individual stores upload their items)??
Anyway :crossed: and hope you stick around, Solar.
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He has promised that the cat will be safe and not PTS before we discuss his future again on Wednesday, I hope we have convinced him that FIV is not a good enough reason in itself to end any cat's life and that if he is otherwise healthy he may have many more years of happiness ahead.
Just a thought cos have been here before (although not with this specific shelter), you might want to consider checking in how the little cat is doing on the telephone each day or even calling at the shelter if you can- until you have that further discussion with the manager. :hug:
As others have said, will be here to support the release of your little man to your care. :hug: :hug:
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Was going to say exactly the same Edd. No matter what you have been told, keep hassling them. We were given assurances with regard to Trooper which all turned out to be "not true", so although it is nice that the Manager of the Shelter is saying these things, do not take them as guaranteed.
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Just to let you know how things are in my mixed FIV+ and FIV- household.
I rescued a stray who had an appalling limp, shredded ears, no manners whatsoever, but had been feeding at my house for months and got along nicely with my other cats. I trapped him and took him to the local vet who neutered him under the RSPCA voucher scheme for me.
Chubby, as we had named him, was blood tested as my household at the time was all FIV-, so I wanted to know if Chubby could come and live with us, thinking that FIV+ would be dangerous. I was gutted when the tests came back positive (we double checked with the lab in Glasgow) but the vet summoned me in for a chat.
My vet said this: many domestic cats are FIV+ without their owners even knowing. Most never succumb to it and the only statistics available are from the stray cat population that only ever get tested for FIV+ when they are rescued, and even these high risk cats only come in at 40% positive. No-one keeps stats of how many domestic cats are FIV+ the proportion could very well be exactly the same.
As Chubby was already on good terms with my residents (three of whom are rescued strays but never blood tested so may indeed be +ve themselves) we decided to give him a chance so he came home with me rather than going to the CPL. I kept him in until his stink subsided and cat proofed the garden so he could go out into the sunshine but not escape (he can't climb because of his dicky hips).
One year on, he never fought, clawed or bit any of my resident cats, he's a sweet boy who has befriended my only female cat and they are now inseparable, and although he still won't allow me to pet him I'm so pleased we have helped this little guy out.
I hope this gives you some hope, FIV+ is not a death sentence and PTS is totally unnecessary unless the animal has secondary symptoms.
I still have views about FeLV, though, as this is highly contagious, unlike FIV+ which is usually only transmitted by deep bite wound, sexual contact or blood transference. I understand that FeLV is also tested for, but you would be wise to ask if this has in fact been done. Bless you for caring. :hug:
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. It seems there was a misunderstanding at the vets and he shouldn't have ended up at the shelter, the vet must have assumed we didn't want to care for him. Now he is at the shelter, the manager feels he has a duty of care to the cat and won't release him until he is in full possession of the facts.
The "duty of care" line is one that they love to use to take animals in when they want to get hold of them, but seems to be forgotten about when you phone them about strays and other sorry cats.
We recently had a cat brought in by the chap who actually hit it with his car - fractured jaw, broken femur and other injuries, and RS*** refused any money for treatment, even further painkillers after initial treatment.
Unfortunately, with no owner claiming the cat and with such severe injuries, we had to put the cat to sleep to save it suffering.
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Solar, could a friend of yours come forward as his "rightful owner", thank you so much wonderful RSPCA for taking in my lad but I'll be taking him back now, I'm so glad he's been found safe and well, I'm so grateful, here's a donation to make you go away...etc etc. It might be a quicker way of getting him out...
I have 7 cats, one of whom is FIV+. He's absolutely fine, you wouldn't know that there was anything wrong to look at him, and after very careful introductions there's been no cross-transmission with any of my other furries in the past 18 months that he's been part of the family.
Good luck, and well done for caring so much about this boy :hug:
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Solar, I agree with Susan + 7. Maybe the best way to get this cat back quickly is to tell a white lie, and find a friend to help. Or tell the RSPCA that you will be keeping him separate from the other cats, whether you are or not.
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I am so pleased that many members have a mix of FIV+ and FIV negs -
Thankfully a lot of the "old fashioned views" are dieing out :cheer:
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I am so pleased that many members have a mix of FIV+ and FIV negs -
Thankfully a lot of the "old fashioned views" are dieing out :cheer:
Isn't it still an issue if cats fight or don't get on though? Don't get me wrong, there's no way I think FIV+ should be PTS. Feel VERY strongly about this!
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Yes fighting would be bad but just not getting on , no problem.
The bottom line is that all of us with rescue cats do not know if they are FIV or not, unless they have been tested.
Most cats with CP are not tested, its only certain CP places that automatically test and then PTS like RSPCA, we have a rehoming centre at Bridgend who do this.
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Yes fighting would be bad but just not getting on , no problem.
The bottom line is that all of us with rescue cats do not know if they are FIV or not, unless they have been tested.
Most cats with CP are not tested, its only certain CP places that automatically test and then PTS like RSPCA, we have a rehoming centre at Bridgend who do this.
Thanks for your answer. I just thought if cats didn't get on, there's a bigger risk of them fighting.
I suppose it's true that a lot of cats aren't tested, unless FIV is suspected.
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I've got two that don't like each other but they never come to blows
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I've got two that don't like each other but they never come to blows
I have a brother and sister who fight. Like humans I guess!
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Just to add in case anyone is concerned that it isn't general CP policy to pts FIV + cats although unfortunately there are still some branches who don't feel they have to abide by national policies. Guidance is to use our judgement on whether to test (our branch only tests those we think are really at risk) and only to pts if very ill and vet advises. So as Gill rightly says there could be a lot more out there than we know because we haven't tested them.
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I thought I should give you the heads up on what I'm thinking and some background. Sorry it's been a few days since I posted and I apologise for the lengthy post. I've had a lot of information to digest and decisions to make.
I am still very concerned about adding this boy to my household and so I am hoping to find him a better home elsewhere. I'll explain my reasons, he is lovely and not aggressive at all though he will hold your hand in his mouth if he's stressed (he doesn't bite though, more a warning). My concern is with my current cat, we rehomed her as she does not tolerate other cats, she had previously been rehomed with 2 of her kittens but after her spay and as the kittens grew up she would not tolerate them, started hissing within a metre of the house and started to lash out at the kittens and children, her personality changed according to her owner, this behaviour was evident when we visited, she seemed very unhappy and refused to go anywhere near the room they were in – it had got to the point where they were being kept separate. She has settled happily with us and seems a completely different cat to our first meeting, that is until she sees or smells another cat which makes her aggressive and angry. We made a discovery recently after we saw her playing with another cat in the garden, I was shocked. I investigated and realised the young cat she was playing with was a girl. Later I noticed her interactions with my neighbour's cats, the usual foul language and claws appeared when she saw the boy, but she showed little interest in the girl. We concluded that her problems with cats was only with male cats and wondered if this was due to the first 18 months of her life being unspayed and constantly chased by toms. After having a discussion with a friend who adopts 'hard to rehome' cats and regularly introduces new cats, we were planning to foster with the intention to adopt a female cat this summer and try and gradual introduction process to see how it went.
I think introducing a male cat to her could be extremely problematic with the added risk (however small) of FIV as well, especially as she gets so aggressive. When they were outside together, she would chase him off so there was never any confrontation that we know of. We used to feed him at night in the conservatory when she was in bed! Inside, in an enclosed space which is her territory, it could get aggressive. I don't want you to think I am anti-FIV – this isn't the case at all. I have to consider my own cat too. I am more than happy to foster this boy where he will be separated from my other cat until a suitable home can be found, preferably with secure outside access which I am unable to offer him, at least in the short term (we are renovating the house).
My other concern is that the RSPCA will not release him to me if they discover I have another cat. They could easily discover this by talking to our vet, there is also someone at the shelter that knows me. So, ultimately if they do release him to me it will be on a foster basis until I find him a better home, I also need a backup plan if they won't release him to me due to my other cat.
So does any one know of a suitable home I could give as an alternative to mine? Preferably a home with FIV+ cats already as this would reassure the RSPCA and vet that the new owners are fully aware of the condition and secure outside access would be a bonus as inside restriction was another concern of theirs. I'm happy to transport him pretty much anywhere if it means a happy home.
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Perhaps tell the RSPCA you will look after the cat for now, separately from other cats, until you can think of something more longterm. Really hope you can get this little one soon! I feel for you both. PM me if you want to chat. :hug: :hug:
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Solar
I don't suppose the manager of the shelter advised what time limits they applied to FIV+ before pts? Before you have further discussions on Wednesday I suspect you will need a range of options for getting this boy out and away from a "rescue organisation" who will pts FIV+.
I am not sure that they will allow you to "foster" this boy until a permanent home comes along - think they will play now in their care they have a "duty of care". Think they will be looking for an adoption. So besides here and on other sites which could produce help from out of your area. You perhaps need to also focus on local help.
Could I suggest that you contact Bob at Catworks. He runs the FIV Sanctuary that Gillian (Ambercat) gave the link to.He is not a million miles away in Somerset and although he is not taking any more cats in he may know of others that could help locally either adoption or rescue. I know that he has always been willing to help and advise on FIV+ cats.
http://www.v63.net/catsanctuary/sanctuary.html
Bob can be contacted by e-mail on the "contact us" page.
Hope this helps
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I really think you need to post this on Cat Chat because help is needed in 24 hours really
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I really think you need to post this on Cat Chat because help is needed in 24 hours really
Gill - Solar has already posted on CC under Rescue and Rehoming.
Solar you might want to also put a summary post under the FIV owner's Club on CatChat as some posters only visit that section :hug:
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Thats good, thanks Edd
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I've put a summary post in FIV owner's Club board on CatChat. I'll also email Bob, thanks again for all the support :thanks:
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I can totally understand your reservations about integrating him with your cat :hug: - I'm going through exactly the same thing with my foster cat Chico who is FIV+ . I would so like to integrate him with mine - but there is a huge issue with my ginger and white mog Harry who hates Chico, and the feeling, unfortunately is mutual. Chico is a lovely gentle boy around most of my others (when I take him out in the garden on his harness) - but when Harry comes on the scene - it is like Jekyll and Hyde :scared:
Good luck with your discussions with RSPCA on Wed :hug:
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I've got him, Alfie is safely here!!!!!!!!! Will update more later. ;D
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Oh I am so pleased :hug: :hug:
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:cheer: :cheer: :dance: :cheer: :cheer:
Fabulous news - so pleased Alfie is safe. ;D Any chance of a pic of the little boy later?. :innocent:
Look forward to your update later :hug:
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wonderful news
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Great news ;D
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Great news, good luck whatever you decide with him.
Nicky
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great news, well done x
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That's fabulous news! Whatever you decide at least the darlng boy is safe now. Well done you, look forward to your update x
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Firstly, thanks to all of you for you help, support and advice, it's been invaluable and essential for saving Alfie. :thanks:
Today went amazingly well, I was prepared for a battle but it didn't turn out that way. Me (and Alfie) were very lucky, the vet that visited him at the shelter was brilliant and extremely knowledgeable regarding FIV and the reality of FIV. She echoed what a lot of you have told me and what I had read and I couldn't have asked for a better person to give him a health check. As a result, the RSPCA manager was happy to release him to me today and despite me offering to pay his bills refused on the basis that I was prepared to offer Alfie a future. He has been true to his word and in the end did what was best for Alfie.
I've gone through a terrible week, hardly eaten or slept and my work has suffered. But as a result of this distressing experience, this has educated me in FIV and more importantly I hope this information will infiltrate the RSPCA with the hope that one day, if enough of us try to educate them, they will change their national policies. After all, education is the only way we can enlighten people regarding FIV and prevent the misinformation spreading.
Thanks again everyone, you helped save a cat's life today. ;D Alfie will be neutered and vaccinated and off to his amazing new home (thank you Lucy :) ) as soon as possible. Here is a photo of him this evening giving you all a high five.
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What a handsome boy and this is all so wonderful, and he has a home too ;D ;D
I agree education is the thing but surely we shouldnt have to be educating the RSPCA!
I hope that it will start to filter through that FIV is just like the HIV in humans but cats seem to do so much better than humans .
Well done for saving this cats life and also to the vet and the manager there.
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Aww he is so sweet :Luv2: :Luv2:-
I am sorry you have been so worried this week. :hug: :hug: Sounds like you had an ally in that vet - hopefully more knowledge is also being gained by vets and they will also challenge rather than comply with the outdated views of a few who insist on FIV+ to be pts straightaway after a in-house test, within 7 days etc.
Well done to you - cos you cared Alfie will be having a better life from today :hug: :hug:
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Wooo hooooo so pleased Alfie is safe .... and has a home! He a lovely looking lad and I'm sure once he has been neutered and settles in his home he will turn into an even more handsome chap. Thank you again for everything you have done for him. :hug:
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So pleased for this wonderful out come !
People need to learn about FIV ....do you know I had a VET tell Me that it could be caught by sharing feeding bowls :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Alfie is beautiful, well done for saving his life
So who is Lucy that is having him ??
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Excellent news! :wow:
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:Luv: He's gorgeous! well done, have you found a home?
will move this now.