Purrs In Our Hearts - Cat Forum UK
Cat Rescue & Rehoming => Rescue & Rehoming General => Topic started by: Canterbury_cats (Sharon) on July 25, 2007, 16:17:01 PM
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Hello all
I have today been trying my best to save a cat from being PTS.. A young male tom been at the emergency vets siince Sat with fractured leg, broken jaw and maybe pelvis problems.. After receiving no meds for his injuries we got him transfereed to another vets that we use.. He is on a drip.. The vets say he leg is very bad, normally if he was owned by someone they would be thinking about fixation and trying to save it but as he is under CP care they think to save money to amputate.. Cost £500 to take the leg off and £700 to save it.. However he will need treatment for his jaw say £100 and also xrays on this back leg.. There are no guarantees that the leg will be fine with fixation, but it could be.. I am in a huge dilennma as want to at least ry to save Jesirir leg, he is only around 12 months old, ginger and white.
Our vet bills lately have been huge Baz aloe costing over £600 quid and then Mabel our FIV cat in our care. Truth is there is more going out then coming in and the bad weather has had a effect on our finances..
I dont make the final descision here, but at our meetng last night before this came to our attenion we was going to do a plea in the papers to help with our growing vets bills and also to see if we can get a home for Milo (blind but senile puss).. But this bill could go into 1000 and i am not sure if my heart is ruling my head....!!
What can be done to a least give Jesiri a chance of saving his leg...!!
Not forgetting the aftercare needed for this one......
Oh my a huge emotion burden and i have no idea what is the best course to take, even if money wasnt an issue..........
Thoughts please!
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A big feature in the local paper with a picture of his sorry face :( you never know you may find an owner but at least you will get donations. Will the local radio do a feature?
Also what about seeing if the battersea program on BBC1 would do an appeal, il look up their contact details...
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Poor little babe :'( I would opt for the amputation if I had him in my care. He could go through all the surgery and pain of having a fixator, and the end result might still be he will have to lose it. He will cope with 3 legs and they do adapt fairly quickly, poor sweetheart though having to go through it all :'(
If you want me to put a plea out re blind puss, email the details and piccie and I'll see what I can do :hug: Also, if you can do a little write up on the little fella, I will send a plea out to try and raise some funds towards his treatment, xxxxxxxxxx
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animalrescuelive@bbc.co.uk they feature cats/dogs from other charities so may feature blind puss for you
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Hi Millys Mum
Milo is on our catchat page along with Mabel another puss with problems....
Still trying to work out what to do for Jesiri (means Gold in African!). Having seen my brothers Burmese have a fixatation on his leg because of injury that has turned out very well, i just want to try the best for this one... But, he will need lots of aftercare, but he could end up with a decent leg.. I dont think the vet would of suggested it if it wasnt possible, just the cost involved. Already on the press realease plea for more funds but that will take a week or so to get in the papers....
Am i being unrealistic on this..?
OMG, three kittens dumped on a driveway on the phone now as well know!
A VERY, VERY BAD DAY!"
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Having spent £1500 2 years ago to save Puma's leg I can see your quandry, If all instructions are followed and the legs looks saveable and the babe can do the cage rest required - we had Puma in a CP Kitten pen lined with clear perspex so that the fixator couldn't catch on anything and he spent 7.5 weeks in this tiny space with about a couple of hours out but no more it became his prision - he was hand reared so thinks anything I do is okay with him he is a poppet.
I hope that he will be ok and that I'm sure that Purrs will help where possible and bully the vet for a bit more discount!
Hope its a good outcome for all concerned :hug:
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Do you need any help with local / regional media contacts (I can look their email addresses up in the directory for you, if so) or have you got them covered already?
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I would also go for amputation of the leg cos they recover so quickly.
Ducha my birman lost a leg before I homed him but originally it was a fix that didnt work.
Is it a front or back leg, cos its better to have 2 front legs if possible.
I do hope that some funds can be found to save him..........I cant believe a vet would not give him meds grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
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Sharon,
Is anyone you know on good terms with animed as they may do it cheaper. I don't think RB is that cheap really. The cats health is the most important thing so I would let him go ahead with the fixation - the difference in cost is that much - even if it takes a while to pay them back. The other day I heard the receptionist at RB telling a customer that some people only pay back £5 a week!
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Its a front left leg.. Bare in mind that his has dodgy pelvis as well, not good with a cat with three legs.. We are using Bourne vets in Bekesbourne as our welare officer is a vet nurse ther and also the vet specializers in bone fixture.. The price is of course a approximation as we are not sure about his mouth/jaw although he eats okay...
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Oh this is so sad. Is the puss only going to be PTS because of costs? Maybe we could get something started on here?
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Sharon
If this dear boy was with me I would fight to save the leg. I have been in this situation before on more than one occasion with a successful outcome;and only once did a cat lose the leg at the end of it. Yes pain and suffering for one but others including a feral happily walking round on 4 legs still. Go with your gut instinct on what is best for him.
:hug:
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Most of us agree to save the leg or do our best to give it a chance.. However, MONEY is an issue no getting away from it.. Baz bill was over 600 quid and only now is he well enough to go to a home.. Also the aftercare, although we are happy to give it a go.. But saying that people often fall for 3 legged cats.. But, if he lost his legs and suffered another injury to another leg in later life then his fate would be sealed i feel.!! If he was older i wouldnt feel so bad, but 12 months of age is a long time to have just 3 legs. If he was my cat i would try my best to keep all four even if there wasnt a good outcome in the end...
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Sometimes you have to let your heart rule your head.
Some people would say he's young he will adapt, but I think with being so young he has to have another chance, even if it dosnt work out as planned he has still had a chance. Then you will know you have done all you can for him.
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I`m sure if we could all rally round and give a little it would help.
Sharon have pm`d you.
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I think as its a front leg and with the pelvis prob you need to try and save the leg.
Lets have some hands up from Purrs members if you would be willing to donate some money to help Jesiri............ any amount will help ;D
I will.
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:hi:
Me too. ;)
(You know what this means by now Gill. lol.)
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The dodgy pelvis does throw a different light on things and I think if you trust your vets judgement, then go along with what he recommends. If the odds are stacked against the leg healing well, then I would still opt for the amputation. If it's down to money, then I'm sure some funding can be raised to help pay for it. Where do they get their prices from :Crazy: :Crazy: When a decision like this has to be made, base it on what is best for the cat, ie how he'll cope with surgery, and being cage rested etc......some cats do cope better than other but it will depend on his temperament. Whatever you decide, I wish him a full and speedy recovery, xxxxxxx
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LOL but lets see what peeps say before we do anything ;D
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Hi all you lovely people. Tomorrow we are going to talk to CP HQ to see if they can beg or borrow some money from their funds.. I am overwhelmed with the lovely people on here that have said they will donate to Jesiri cause.. Its very humbling!! Let us see how we get on tomorrow and see what is agreed...But CP are there for cases like Jesiri, and i am soooooo annoyed at the vets for not at least making him comfortable until someone decided to take matter into their own hands.. and do somthing..............
Jesiri would of been PTS today if we had not intervened not because he was on deaths door, but because his injuries cost to much to fix!!! A terrible state of affairs.....................!
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I am told his temperate is good, although he wasnt happy without pain relieft and he was getting dehydrated......But if a Burmese can stand 6 weeks cage rest then i am sure he can. He was okay in the small vet pen so i was told!
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LOL GILL.
Ok so could this appeal be moved to somewhere its going to get more noticed? Something is better than nothing and the aims of Purrs is not just to chat its to do some well needed fundraising aswell. :)
Good on you for not letting the poor puss be PTS :)
PS is it only a matter of costs? or does the vet think he has used all of his 9 lives?
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Let us know how it goes with CP HQ and then we can take it from there.
I agree about that vet, someone should break his leg and jaw and just leave him >:( >:( >:(
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The initial vet does sound an :censored: tbh >:( >:( Why would it have hurt them to give him pain relief :censored: The RSPCA will pay up to £60 for an injured stray and the idea is so the animal can emergency treatment and be made comfortable :censored: :censored:
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Theres no way i could be a vet as i know i would be fixing so many animals for free rather than them being PTS !!
What :censored: me off is that its only the vets time that will actually cost the main bulk of the cost for this poor cat !
If a collection is started on Purrs please let me know as i will send something
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Both the surgeries I use are fab when it comes to injured strays. There was a cat in the other week that had to have a leg amputated and they did it regardless of costs, one in the other surgery the other day that had been hit by a car........the cat was treated and also rehomed from the surgery.
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Both the surgeries I use are fab when it comes to injured strays. There was a cat in the other week that had to have a leg amputated and they did it regardless of costs, one in the other surgery the other day that had been hit by a car........the cat was treated and also rehomed from the surgery.
Thats how it should be Dawn
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Hello all
I have lost track of the posts here. Isobel rang me to say that since Jesiri has been at her vets they have discovered there is an infection in the leg and therefore we agrees with the vet that the chances of the leg healing would be minimal... All because no vet gave anykind of treatment for him since Saturday, until my niece found out about his cause.... Poor mite and i feel so angry at them..... All because no one would agree to pay the bill.... If we had caught him earlier we may of been able at least give it a go but know Isobel tends to agree its a lost cause really and she is "one of us" so i take her advise on board... But i still feel bad.................
He is a very small puss and really they are amazed the RTA didnt kill him outright..............
Its a very sorry ending though, but at least we can give me a life, if not one with four legs maybe 3.............
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Sorry I am confused, does that mean you are going for an amputation or PTS :(
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We have no intention of putting this mite to sleep. So unless things drastically change and the infection gets better, this little mite will have his leg amputated tomorrow..., his jaw fixed and xray of this pelvis....and neutered!!!
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OMG, three kittens dumped on a driveway on the phone now as well know!
Just to let you know these kittens are now in our care........one succumbed to the road today though before we were able to do anything and the person reporting them to us became very unhelpful. So we know have just the two..Mum may of been involved in RTA, they are 6 weeks old though and other then sticky eyes and VERY hungry, worms and fleas seem okay...
Endless calls for cats in distress.... i could tell you about three more.........
What a rotten day!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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I've just found out the recent events, including your email to me, Sharon. Words fail me.... :rage:
He's young, Sharon. He'll adjust well to three legs, I'm sure. But the biggest thing we have to hope for now is that his pelvis is okay. You can always call me.
Jxxx
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Thanks for clarifying that Sharon.
Now next question is have you got the money or dont you know yet?
So many cats need help :(
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Tomorrow we are going to talk to CP HQ to see if they can beg or borrow some money from their funds
Seems to me that CP HQ is goiing to be flooded (excuse the pun) with requests for additional funds from Gloucester and similar places. It's up to us guys me thinks...
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Just before i call it a night. I still say and this is my own opinion that if he was my cat, i would still give the leg a go.. I NEVER give up some hope, but if the infection is in the leg it must be painful for him and no amount of pinning is going to help.. Infection before the op is not good for infection after the opp.. But then i see it as we do our utmost best and hate it when money comes into the situation.
The vets that Jesiri went to first of all saved my Siamese cat life Bella for there care and attention and experts on hand to do with heart conditions. But it seems they totally loose it with strays if they dont see they will get paid or the RSPCA get involved its just pain relief then nothing really.. !!! What is the difference... one is just owned by someone and i had insurance the other wasn't. Due to their lack of duty of care, poor Jesiri probably ends up losing his leg. It makes me dam mad!! i tell you......Why didnt they contact us before hand..? Why didnt they at least do something. The RSPCA were informed but no log nubmer was forthcoming and the outcome would of been PTS. No one even bothered to see if he belonged to someone (no chip, found a long way from this vets on Sat PM).. He was just fed and watered and left really!!
I am real mad at them..!! There are only two out of hours vets in the area, one main hospital and the other a smaller practice that dealt with Baz. Who is now thankfull a picture of health and a no way from the pitfull state when we was picked up by them... So although the larger practice did save my cats life and got paid for their troubles (and indeed another cat in the family a Burmese was successfully treated there for broken leg also insured and is now fine) their treatment of strays is horrid!!!
They should be ashamed of themselves.................
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In answer to Gill.
Sharon tells me that the recent rain and bad weather has hit our fundraising hard. We usually do well at table sales in Hearne Bay and Whitstable, but these are dead right now... :scared:
Sharon is one resourceful and determined lady, and having read and seen the way she fought for our Baz, she's not going to give up without a fight. ;) It's just a shame that Jasiri comes to close on the heals of Baz - Baz only goes to his forever home on Saturday. :shy:
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I totally agree with you and no wonder you are angry.
just because it didnt have an owner doenst mean it should have been treated like that. I know that was double negative but I am sure you know what I meant.
Poor cat deserved to be treated decently and Rspca also strike again it seems.
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Kate (Spangle) i have sent you a PM!
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I will make a donation. You haven't got a Paypal account have you Sharon?
Quite happy for you to use mine if it will speed up getting the money - I will pay the paypal charges. Also, I want to know which vet Jesiri was at first as I want to make sure none of mine ever end up there - I thought people became vets as they cared about animals, not money. We know they have to make a living but it could have only cost a few pounds max to make puss comfortable >:(
As for the kittens, do you think the girl I am doing a homecheck on tonight would wait a few weeks for them to be ready? - I know she sounded like she wanted them yesterday but she is young.
Also wanted to say that there are hundreds of members but only a handful ever seem to donate to anything. I appreciate that some people have little or no cash to spare but with paypal, the 50p's & £1's add up if enough people put in.
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Aww, fingers crossed for a good outcome for him - although the price for an amputation seems high. Such a shame that the original vets didn't do more for the little mite, but he has a chance now.
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I have a PM message last night that i will be chasing up after 9pm.. But does anyone SE based (preferably Kent) konw of any bone specialist vets that i could talk to that may be able to give advise..re infection.. BUT time is of the essence, they cannot put the amputation of much longer and its scheduled to be done today.. However, the vet looking after Jesirii is willing to speak to a specialist in the field.. I have one contact, anybody know of any others.
I dont give up that easily do i?
But we may be too late infection may be too severe!
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Either way, put me down for a donation. Its heartbreaking that the poor little dude could have been saved the suffering with prompt treatment. But, I guess a happy life with three legs is better than no life at all.
The fecking vets should be reprimanded for that.
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although the price for an amputation seems high
That is what I thought.
I have never known just £200 difference between amputation and all that goes with trying to save the leg.
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uPDATE
I am getting a bones vet to talk to our vet today and make a final decision.. But either way its going to cost us money! But at least we have a chance with a specialist vet talking to each other..
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although the price for an amputation seems high
That is what I thought.
I have never known just £200 difference between amputation and all that goes with trying to save the leg.
[/quote
Our Smokey's cost that last year.
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Our Smokey's cost that last year.
For a straight forward amputation we have never paid more that £250 usually less.
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Dont forget the jaw and pelvis problems and also he needs neutering.. All very guessamates at the moment, thats the guide lines i was given... I supose they dont know until they start!
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Now, people, with all that has gone on in the last day or so i am very tired and need a break from this PC screen. BUT, just has a phone call from the vets..
He will stay on drip today and antibotics and our vet will be in discussion with the specialist vet in our area.. Since so many people have offered to help with costs including other CP branches, i feel that with donations we can probably cover the cost if the leg can be saved (and he is in no pain and has a chance if only a slim one to recover use of it) However, i dont know the final outcome until tomorrow.. If referral is needed then fine, theother specialist vet is very well thought off...
All i can say is that you have all been wonderful and as the vets now knows the cost shouldnt be an issue, i hope (considering welfare etc) we can at least give it a try.. They actually said one day more of IV fluids would probably be a good idea anyhows..
I am sorry i have no photos, as he has been at the vets all this time, my Niece may have on from her mobile phone though..
You have all been fab and i thank you so much for all your help!
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It sounds as though he has a good chance and now at least he can be given this wonderful chance and its nice to know that the folks here are going to help, as are other CP Branches
Isn't Purrs a wonderful place we are geographically changing the way that the furkids can get help :hug:
Liz and the Clan Cats
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I will be happy to donat towards treatment :)
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I'll be happy to send a small donation........sadly I can't afford much as I have my own to sort out but every little will help :hug:
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Don’t forget the jaw and pelvis problems and also he needs neutering..
rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr that is where the confusion is, as in the original post it was stated However he will need treatment for his jaw say £100 and also xrays on this back leg
I thought that was as well as the £700.
Also You will be able to pay for the full cost of the neuter on a yellow CP voucher so that should also help a little.
feel that with donations we can probably cover the cost if the leg can be saved
That is good news
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I will be happy to donat towards treatment :)
Me too
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Sorry everyone for confusing things.. Yep voucher is on its way, but this vet gives us huge discount on vet bills anyhow..
The fracture will cost around 700 to fix as well as 100 or so for the jaw and then xrays of leg.. So final cost could be 900 quid or something.. He has already been FELV tested (all clear).. However, vet cannot really give a definate price just an approx. The referall vet may quote higher or may be less, or may do it for nothing! it is a very nasty fracture and will take many hours to fix... After care is xrays and antibotics and other med i pressume..
All prices were approx i am afraid...
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Our Smokey's cost that last year.
For a straight forward amputation we have never paid more that £250 usually less.
Really! Is that because you're a rescue Ela?
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I think when I had Miska done, my vet charged me £65 all in so I think I got a good deal really.
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I think it all depends on the complexity of the operation, any discounts the vet may or may not give and the area you live in.
It really doesnt matter what other vets charge, in this case just the charge that will eventually be made for poor Jeseri.
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It really doesnt matter what other vets charge, in this case just the charge that will eventually be made for poor Jeseri.
Nobody's saying it does, but it just shows how much of a rip off most vets are.
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I have sent a small contribution for Jesiri to you, Canterbury Cats.
Also wanted to say that there are hundreds of members but only a handful ever seem to donate to anything. I appreciate that some people have little or no cash to spare but with paypal, the 50p's & £1's add up if enough people put in.
Be assured: I know some people donate to different rescues from time to time without mentioning it on here. :Luv:
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Will see what I can do penny wise, but very bad time at the moment!!
When Pebbles had her leg amputated last year, I can't remember the full amount, but I know I paid £289 for the pin removal and it was less than that (although bearing in mind the pin removal was done by the out of hours vet). As she was mine, that was the full price. IT is sad that it is so high for poor Jeseri, he could have had a completely different outcome purely cos of money.
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IT is sad that it is so high for poor Jeseri, he could have had a completely different outcome purely cos of money.
I think we all second that Desley.
For donations to help please wait for Sharon to tell us what is needed and how to send ;D
Thank you to everyone who is offering to help ;D
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I have sent a small contribution for Jesiri to you, Canterbury Cats.
Also wanted to say that there are hundreds of members but only a handful ever seem to donate to anything. I appreciate that some people have little or no cash to spare but with paypal, the 50p's & £1's add up if enough people put in.
Be assured: I know some people donate to different rescues from time to time without mentioning it on here. :Luv:
I'm sure they do but "aint too proud to beg" :evillaugh:
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It really doesnt matter what other vets charge, in this case just the charge that will eventually be made for poor Jeseri.
Nobody's saying it does, but it just shows how much of a rip off most vets are.
That's right just conversation really.
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I will be happy to donat towards treatment :)
Me too but will have to be after pay day (31st) now. Is there a paypal address? If not I have your address Sharon so will send a cheque, payable to Cats Protection or does your group have a specific name?
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Thank you all for offering to donate to Jesiri cause.. But please let me at least get the final answer tomorrow, so at least everybody is aware of what they are donating too.. Its heartrending to know that so many people care and as most of us are as skint as can be with our own problems, you still care enough to help..
South East is renowed for higher vets bills.. Also i want to make sure that everyone that decides to help gets thanked by all of us... Our CP rep is not around today, because ideally it would be nice to find out how much they can contribute to the cause, then at least i know what we are looking at to make up..
Without a plan of action from the vets it hard to give you amount that we need. I want to make sure everyone is happy to donate to the cause whatever the outcome for poor Jesiri.. But with all our fingers crossed you never know the other vet may be prepared to do it for free!! We can only but hope!!
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I want to make sure everyone is happy to donate to the cause whatever the outcome for poor Jesiri..
I think that goes without saying :hug: Nobody knows what his outcome will be but he deserves a chance regardless, xxxx
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if it's a particularly challenging case (and it sounds like it) the specialist vet might like to use it as a teaching opportunity for students .......... I think I would be inclined to suggest it if he is affiliated with a teaching facility... that way it could indeed be free (or costs of materials)
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Really! Is that because you're a rescue Ela?
No
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Even if you include their time, some vet prices are extortionate which doesn't do the animal any favours because it puts people off getting them treated when needed. If you look at some of the past threads on Purrs and CC, there would have been animals died because the Emergency Call out has been too expensive so they've waited til morning which can then be too late.
Not all vets have the resources to have someone manning the practice 24/7.
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CC
It varies from vet to vet. My one has a nurse who stays on the premises when animals are critical and checks them every couple of hours. She can call the vet in if she thinks it's urgent.
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Quick Q-
when there are sick animals that have to be kept in pens is there a vet there at all times, even through the night?
No
I live next door to a vet. They come by around 11pm and again about 7am - a vet practice doesn't have to have someone there all the time but an animla hospital does. Therefore if it were any of mine, they would come home with me unless it was dangerous to move them.
My friends 14 year old was kept in my vets overnight for rehydration and died in the night :'( - they could tell her what time but said "probably around 2am :'( "
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This is a polite request:
Do you think we can leave this thread open for matters about Jesiri, so we dont have to scroll for miles to find Sharons posts.
Thanks ;D
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lostcatsbrighton will make a donation Mark Let me know where to send a cheque and who to make it out to, lets get it rolling for the poor little mite Ron, :( :(
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I will be happy to make a small donation ... if someone can let me know where to make a payment I would be grateful :Luv:
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lostcatsbrighton will make a donation Mark Let me know where to send a cheque and who to make it out to, lets get it rolling for the poor little mite Ron, :( :(
Hi Ron, Its Sharon the money will be going to - she will give the details out tomorrow.
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Hello all
Update.. I am afraid bad news. The truth of the matter is that Jesiri injuries to his leg make it impossible for it to be fixed.. Its just been left to long and he is already suffering... The truth is that he has probably already lost the leg to infection. Thus vets advise and welfare grounds we are going to go ahead with amputation.. Sorry its not good news, but he is young and will cope in time. This at least gives him a quality of life.
No news on the pelvis yet, but we hope that is a mnor problem.
Sorry people but we all tried and no matter what money was in the pot it wouldn't make alot of difference to the fact that the leg was left too long.
Anyone who wishes to donate to Jesiri care will post details next.
Thanks people for your support..
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So sorry to hear this news and hope that the amputation will go well, :hug: :hug: :hug: for Jesiri.
We await details for donations.
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Hello all.
As i have been swamped with people asking me for details to donate to help Jesiri, details are as follow.. Firstly, we do have a PO BOX number and its emptied whenever one of us can get that way, which isnt that often as the Post office is abit out of our way..
So can i plaease plea to people to send to our Branch Secretary, that way the funds get to us quicker..
Also you would do us a great favour if you were able to just write "Jesiri" on the back of chqs (not the envelope), that way we can have a dedicated fund for this treatment and you know that its going to him directly.. Our branch secretary is a lovely lady and will give out gift aid forms on request.. We can give receipts as well, but if you can give us an email address i can then send you an email to say we received the chq so you know it was receieved okay . Pls bare with us, poor Jane does this with little help and there may be a delay in sending or replying to you. If you use email we can save on stamps for receipts.. I will promise to keep you all update via the forum.
So mark the chq (not the envelope) for the attention of Jesiri fund
Chq payable to Canterbury and District Cats Protection
Canterbury and District Cats Protection
C/O Jane Holness Branch Secretary
3 Austin Road, Studd Hill, Herne Bay, Kent, CT6 8BL..
Our branch telephone number is 01227 266838 if anyone wants to talk to a branch member.. its 01227 360432 if you want to speak to me on the CP Homing line (but its may go to answerphone). If people have objections to donations being sent direct to Jane then of course pls send to our PO box (PO Box 833, Canterbury, Kent, CT1 1WH). Still marking it for the attention of Jane and write Jesiri on back of cheque..
and finally please don't think that even small amount's don't help, because believe you me they will.............!!
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Aww thats so sad, if the vets had of helped him in the first place... >:(
Will be able to send a small dontation in the post :)
Is that th addy I send it to?
(I'll have to find my checkbook)
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Yes CC
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CQ in the post c/o Jane's address tonight.
Can't afford much as too many car bills to pay this month, but I guess a little from a lot of people = quite a bit.
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but he is young and will cope in time.
It is a shame, however, even older cats adapt remarkable quickly to 3 legs. To be honest I personally thought amputation was going to be the final outcome.
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The poor little man - its worse because it could have been treated. What were the original vets thinking?
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Poor Baby. I agree Clare, if all that could sent a little it would add up to a lot.
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Just a thought - not saying I don't trust the Post Office but if you put "Jesiri's fund" on the envelope it may tempt some unscrupulous people to open the envelope and take any donation in there. I know in theory no-one should be able to cash a cheque without ID but it can happen.
Fingers crossed he pulls through this.
Karen
x
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Hello again!
So right about the envelope having that on it.. So folks far better to just put something on back of chq. My fault i should of thought about that abit more..
Thanks for making me think about it..
No news from the vets today as of yet, i am sure Isobel will keep me posted though later on today
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i am sure he will cope well, Pebbles did and she was 11. Good luck with him, and at least you know you did everythign you could, and that amputation is the best thing for him.
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Hello again!
So right about the ennelope having that on it.. So folks far better to just put something on back of chq. My thought i should of thought about that abit more..
Hope you don't mind I've edited your original post to take out all the 'mark the envelope' references. Will send my donation after payday still if that's OK. Paws crossed that Jesiri makes a quick recovery :hug:
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:wow:
FAB NEWS, A MAJOR MIRACLE! I AM IN AWE!!
Jesiri still has four legs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
After xrays it was found the leg had started to heal and thus talk with specialist vet and discussion as to all the options. It was decided he be fixed up with a plaster and dressing to aid healing.. He does have a broken pelvis (in an unusual place but nothing to be done but cage rest). He has got a broken jaw (but not so bad as Basil case) AND if that wasnt bad enough this wonder puss may end up losing part of his tail.
All in all this puss should be dead!"!!!!! But he is still alive and kicking and one amazing puss................................
So all he needs know is time and a great deal of luck that the infection can be kept under control and that 5 or 6 wks of cage rest will allow the leg to heal.. It may not be perfect (far from it) and we have a way to go before he is on the real road to recovery, but i am amazed. And thanks to the dedication of the vets and Isobel our welfare officer he may have a good chance of recovery...........
He may be able to come home weekend to me after Baz has been rehomed (he is well on the road to recovery and a cheeky little monkey!!). My niece a vet nurse will hopefully be okay doing his dressings and we then just have to hope for the best for this puss. .Who truely is lucky to be alive..
I want to thank all you wonderful people out there who have donated money to his operation and aftercare.. It will be used to aid his recovery. He will need xrays in the future, lots of dressing changes, med for the infection and pain relief, jaw fixture removal, maybe tail amputation in the future and something money cannot buy load of love and TLC. I wish there was something we could set up for other cats like Jesiri for the future, perhaps a fund that Purrs could handle, and then every so often it is given out to so needy causes of cats in a desperate situation.. We are in awe of your help and particularly this time of year when funds are running low....Its humbling to see how well a Forum such as this can make a difference to an animals life....so that rather then money being the issue to help him, it was at least taken out the equation, as we were able to get specialist help to aid decisions. Both vets have been wonderful in just doing their best.
Best wishes to you all...
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BTW I will get photos to you as soon as i can, but at the moment the poor mite has been through so much and i didnt want to ask poor Isobel to do photos as she has enough on her plate.. You will have photos as soon as he is with us.....
However, i gather he may not look his best....!! :innocent:
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Awesome news!!! :hug:
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Keep us posted...
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This sounds like a miricle and my cheque will be in the post over the weekend ;D
Come Jesiri, get well soon :hug:
Possibly because he is so young he is healing quicker than an older cat would, hats off to the new vet.
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Great news Sharon, he deserves a bit of luck after his previous bad (Non) treatment. It makes a nice change to hear things like that. Must be a mix of good luck and youth + a lot of TLC :Luv:
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Excellent news. Will be glad to hear updates. It was good to catch up with you all yesterday
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Wow, this is so wonderful to hear, I truly hope he does well and that cage rest works wonders for him.
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Brilliant News!!
I'll send cheque today :)
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I think Jeseri has more than one Guardian Angel watching over him.
Sending lots of positive healing vibes.
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That's fantastic news :Luv:
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I've just spoken to the vet treating Jesiri on a different matter. He tells me everybody there is in love with this puss and he's hopeful for a decent recovery. He wants to take it slow, though. He says he's responding well so far. Little Jesiri is cetainly in very good hands now. :Luv: ;)
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Jesiri is coming home to us on Monday...
At the moment his bill is running at around £600.00,which is probably around the same as Baz was overall. However, we need to do his dressings every 3 days or so and he will need an xray in a month or so...He will be on painkillers and antiobitcs but i think that is it...
Keep you all posted when i know more..
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I am just so thrilled to hear that Jesiri will be coming home to you, Canterbury Cats, and on all four legs too :wow:
I have mailed my little contribution, but there was a post strike up here, apparently, so it may not arrive until Tuesday.
:Luv: to Jesiri and his carers
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Excellent news.
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Hello all
Update on our Jesiri
I wanted to upload some photos but my camera is having a bad day... Bare with me...
Jesiri is very thin, but seems a very good patient. He probably isnt a year old.. He will probably loose his tail, but he has to go back in 3wks for the jaw inplant to be removed,so they will probabaly do that then.. The jaw is broken at the side and not the middle and a dodgy canine is keeping it all together. They have left that in so they have something to fix the jaw too.
He dosnt seem too bothered.
The dressing on his leg is huge, a great pink bandage!! A sweet liittle cat, that is abit bemused by all the attention.. vet reckons with TLC and time he will be 95 percent healthy in around 2 months or so time.. He has fabalous yellow eyes and very cute face... At the moment he is very weary and his eyes seem to follow your around the room and then he nods of every now again.
He hasnt moved from his igloo all afternoon but he has biscuits and food to keep him occupied, but he is confined to a kitten pen for at least the next 4 wks or so... He does put weight on his leg, but his pelvis makes him walk (if you can call it walking) very funnily indeed.. His tail just hangs there but he can feed and go to the loo fine.. He is keeping himself very clean and tries to wash himself every now again..
He weigh just over 2.5kilograms, but eats well, the jaw not causing him too much trouble.. He is on meds and dressing changing every two days..
A real wonder puss, his small size helping his injuries i think... The pelviis is broken but rest should allow it to heal, not to keen you touching his leg though...He hasnt bitten or growled or anything..A real sweetie..
Vet reckons he had all those injuries for over a week to 10 days before he was taken to the vets and then another week at the other vets. So probabaly a good 3 wks worth there.. I am amazed he survived feeding himself as a stray.
Well worth saving? I think so............
Thanks a million everybody..
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Vet reckons he had all those injuries for over a week to 10 days before he was taken to the vets and then another week at the other vets. So probabaly a good 3 wks worth there.. I am amazed he survived feeding himself as a stray.
Thats heartbreaking, to think that he was struggling like that.
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Jesiri sounds a very brave little puss.
:hug: to him
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What a brave little soldier :Luv:
Where is he Sharon? - Maybe I could get some pics tomorrow as I probably have time to nip over to Sharns to get the kitten pics. I still can't get my head around a vaet who is supposed to care about animals, letting him suffer like that for the sake of a couple of £ in meds.
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Aww, he is a very lucky cat, and I hope he makes a wonderful recovery.
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What a wonderful story of courage and love from your end
lets hope he continues on his healing way and Tiger our feral alpha male says he has a stump where his tail used to be ( losst to an RTA April 2001 when he was still very feral so cage rest was a challange!) and it can still move with attitude!!! :Crazy:
Lots of purrs and healing thoughts
Liz and the Clan Cats
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Well done to that very brave kitty, he is a right little soldier.
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Such a brave puss, so pleased that after all his suffering he's on the way to a good recovery, and then a wonderful new forever home I hope.
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Hi all
With much devious means using my camera, i have managed to get some photos out of it. Although dosnt really solve the problem with my PC and camera, this is via my laptop.
But just so you know what he looks like....
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Oh bless him, sorry I couldnt help but giggle about his bandage :evillaugh:
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Awww, he's lovely. He looks thoroughly confused!
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Think he should get a boy coloured bandage at the next change as he is such handsome boy :Luv:
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awwwww, sooooo sweet
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Aww bless him :Luv: i agree he needs a blue bandage
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Payday has arrived... finally! Will send off my donation ASAP :)
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He os lovely and you are right about the enormous bandage.............think blue would go better with his suit :rofl: :rofl:
I been away so will try and send my cheque tomorrow. ;D
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clearly the vet has never been to fashion school. Pink! on a redhead!!! Surely a vibrant emerald green would be better :rofl:... Glad to see him looking so well. :Luv:
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Aww, he is lovely.
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Sending positive healing vibes to this very beautiful boy.
Thank goodness he`s with you Sharon :hug:
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Just to let you all know Jesiri is doing very well. We change his bandage every two days and he seems to cope well. He loves his food but sleeps alot... But his eyes folllow you around all the time. He has a lovely temperament and loves his chin tickled.. Afraid to say i am falling in love with him...............
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He sounds a lovely man ;D
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Aww, he sounds like a special little man.
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Just to let you all know Jesiri is doing very well.
:)
Afraid to say i am falling in love with him...............
I can understand that :Luv:
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Pleased he's doing well ;D
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Great news that he's doing well - I think I'd fall in love with him too :Luv: :Luv:
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So pleased to hear this lovely boy is doing well. Well done Sharon
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Am so please he is doing well and how could you not fall for him, he is lovely and is coping really well with his banadge changes - hope they are more boy coloured!
Will send some pennies at the end of next week as cheque book still in Dublin although I'm sure I thought it was here!
Good healing thoughts - :hug:
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We get Jesiri out his pen for a few times each day so to avoid muscle wastage.. He has a habit of manageing to get his bandages off.. So far he walks really weird but seems to cope.. He just eats and eats and eats... I found out that he was originally found in a barn in Faversham (very rural) part of Kent. He has a very femine miew, tolerates being handled and seems to just enjoy watching you.. However, i can see him eyeing up jumping on tables. No doubt when he is better he will be...
But is a superb patient very tolerant, i think he realises we are doing him some good. Still on meds which he takes well
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Another photos of our Jesiri!
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What a handsome fellow :Luv: :Luv:
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he is lovely :)
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Aww, glad he is doing well.
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Hope Jesiri is continuing to do well? :hug: to him.
When Blip had to have a bandage, she managed to get the whole thing off in one undamaged piece (how? :Crazy:) so Jesiri is obviously a kindred spirit.
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He's gorgeous isn't he. Well done everyone. I can't see how yet again I managed to miss this important thread . I would like to send a contribution also if I may . Could someone let me know where to please . I could do an instant online payment if I had the account details .
I wonder if it would be a good idea to have a special forum at the top solely for appeals ? that way all of us will see them all every time we visit. It probably just needs to be a single locked post with the details photo etc and where to contribute . I'm sure it will allow more members the opportunity to give something
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Nick... I dug this out for you.
I haven't heard news of Jesiri for a few days, but the last I heard he was responding well, and the bill so far was £500 and Sharon is so grateful for the help people on purrs have given Jesiri's fund.
He's a lovely wee soul and in the best of care now. What a shame we didn't find him earlier as we gather the poor thing had been living in a barn with these injuries for up to a week!
Hello all.
As i have been swamped with people asking me for details to donate to help Jesiri, details are as follow.. Firstly, we do have a PO BOX number and its emptied whenever one of us can get that way, which isnt that often as the Post office is abit out of our way..
So can i plaease plea to people to send to our Branch Secretary, that way the funds get to us quicker..
Also you would do us a great favour if you were able to just write "Jesiri" on the back of chqs (not the envelope), that way we can have a dedicated fund for this treatment and you know that its going to him directly.. Our branch secretary is a lovely lady and will give out gift aid forms on request.. We can give receipts as well, but if you can give us an email address i can then send you an email to say we received the chq so you know it was receieved okay . Pls bare with us, poor Jane does this with little help and there may be a delay in sending or replying to you. If you use email we can save on stamps for receipts.. I will promise to keep you all update via the forum.
So mark the chq (not the envelope) for the attention of Jesiri fund
Chq payable to Canterbury and District Cats Protection
Canterbury and District Cats Protection
C/O Jane Holness Branch Secretary
3 Austin Road, Studd Hill, Herne Bay, Kent, CT6 8BL..
Our branch telephone number is 01227 266838 if anyone wants to talk to a branch member.. its 01227 360432 if you want to speak to me on the CP Homing line (but its may go to answerphone). If people have objections to donations being sent direct to Jane then of course pls send to our PO box (PO Box 833, Canterbury, Kent, CT1 1WH). Still marking it for the attention of Jane and write Jesiri on back of cheque..
and finally please don't think that even small amount's don't help, because believe you me they will.............!!
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thanks Julie I'll get something off in the post. glad to hear he's doinf so well. he is a little gorgeous but then I do love the gingers :Luv:
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Cheeky monkey Jesiri is doing well. The other night he took his dressing off and we were doing that at 10pm at night, he is such a good patient, no wriggling or biting.. His attitude is one of pure joy that someone is taking care of him.. His pelvis is still abit all over the place, but his leg is doing well.. He will got back next Friday to have his jaw mental removed.. Funny thing is that he gets that mental bit tangled in his blanket!!! Silly sausage.. His tail will def be going though, no improvement at all.. Limp at the base and its getting in his way..
He eats for Europe combined... so far we have given him 3 sachets of felix in one sitting and he still wants more!!! (he has been wormed!!)
He is such a darling, not many other cats would put up with this....
More photos over the weekend pls... In the last 10 days or so we have taken the stock of the local vets, 15 bandages he has got through...the liittle devil...
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25 smackeroonies on the way , not much i know but I have donated nearly £200 this month already :-: ;D
how is his fund doing ? sounds like I should maybe send a shed load of food as well lol
Looking forward to seeing some more piccys . he sure is a lucky fella to have you as his Mum ;D
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Thanks to everybody and some donations by our members as well, Jesiri fund is doing well and will now probably cover his ongoing costs at the vets and his other operations. He is never ever going to be perfect though!
The appeal thread, i think would be a great idea... Without some funds being available at the time we took in Jesiri just after having Baz in our care which cost us 600 quid, i doubt we would of been able to do as much as we committed ourselves too. He was going to loose a leg and i did manage to get him referred to a specialist vet for advise to our vet.. He thus now has four legs but will prob loose his tail!.
Lilly also will benefit from the publicity of Jesiri as she may also need abit more vet care... All in all our bills on 3 (Solomon, Baz and Jesiri and Mabel, FIV and thyroid) cats in the last 4 months have been around 2500 which is an big chunk of fundraising money.. Espc as the weather up until now has been so poor...May not seem much compared to other CP branches, but we are a small branch with only a few fosterers and not many reliable volunteers that fundraise tirelessly.. However, 3 wks ago we did rehome our 100 cat so far this year which is going to make us exceed our total for year and the last 4 years the most ever having rehomed is 160 in one year.. We have though this year had over 50 kittens in our care and more just last weekend (one mum and 5 kittens).. Kittens are very expensive!!!!
We choose to chip, vac and of course neuter all our adult cats, and although we could save money by not chipping we have decided something else should go before that... Mainly becuase i get so annoyed when people ring me up and their cat isnt chipped!! We get 2 calls a day about lost cats hardly any of them have been chipped, and i no that some of the cats that we have rehomed and were chipped, we have been able to help them when they have needed medical care. A cat missing for 1 yrs Freda who we rehomed last year, went AWOL and was taken to a local vet found to be chipped via us.. Freda had been out for a year, but had cancer and although we tried her best she was PTS.. I dread to think how she would of suffered if we didnt get to here about her..
Sorry for the waffle and abit of thread!
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So pleased that Jeisri is doing well and I feel guilty cos I have an envelope address for Jesiri and keep forgetting to post it.............must do tonight ;D
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Hi all
I lost to thread to this, but thought to say to you all that Jesiiri continues to do well. Now he dosnt need his dressing all the time and it s aright little character..........He now hops around like scooby doo........His pelvis is taking time to heal and we put off having his jaw fixture done this week for another week of rest..
Now a little secret....the longer Jesiri stays with us the more he is getting on with the fosterers (my brothers) two elderly cats.. they dont seem to take alot of notice of him now and he never growls or hisses at them.. So all t hings considered, Jesiri will slowly and surely intergrate and i reckon will end up staying with us.........We are just cautious that as he gets better his other character comes out but so far he is the most laid back puss i know (other then my Leo)! He would suit a home with us as we are fairly rural and and woods around us and his hoppy character would be safe as can be...He would be well loved as well........in fact he would be more then loved he would be adored.. They have done a fantastic job with his aftercare and its so nice to see him improve... He will never be perfect and will also i reckon walk like John Wayne but who cares!!!!
We are just thinking about how we would go about getting a cat such as Jesiri insured.not for his current problems but for others........
Anyhows time will tell ................
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aww, glad there is such a good outcome, and he will have a fab home. I should imagine you can insure him, but anythign that could relate to his jaw or leg will be excluded. Worth a chat with an insurance company.
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I think that Jesiri would be very grateful to you ;D
We want some more pics please ;D
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It all sound good for Jesiri ;D
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He will never be perfect and will also i reckon walk like John Wayne but who cares!!!!
He will always be perfect in your eye and thats all that matters.........big hugs :hug: :hug:
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Aw, glad the future is looking so bright for this little darling :Luv:
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Thrilled that Jesiri is on the mend and that he has landed on his paws after all his misery.
Attaboy, Jesiri ;)
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Well Jesiri will have the life of Riley at yours Sharon - glad he's on the mend :Luv:
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UPDATE
Jesiri went to the vets today, they took off his tail but they though the jaw had not quite healed up. xrays revealed some slight infection in his leg and thus is now on different meds for a week. Nothing serious but something to keep on top off. Good job he went in for his tail as well, as that was going abit bad!!
AND ITS OFFICIAL he will be staying with us.. I dont mean me personally, as i have two cats Leo and Bella but I am lucky to be surrounded by woodlands and another family member that just lives a few feet away from me will be taking him on.. They have been his fosterers for the last few weeks and it has now fully adjusted to life with their two elderly cats.... In five years of fosterering he has become the only one that has managed to stay!! And believe me he has had some competition.
Jesiri thus still needs to go back and have his jaw done, but the vet was frightened he would fracture it again if he took it out today.. He will always limp very badly but hey!! No one is perfect.
I promise to get some photos to you all........just have started a new job this week, so its all manic....
As for the life of Riley!! Well i hope Mark doesnt mind me mentioning it but last time he dropped at cat off to us, he got lost getting out our driveway!! (sorry!))) Mark.... But we have a long and dark driveway surrounded by woods so its easily done, isnt it#?
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That is brilliant news, I am so pleased for him, he deserves it.
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Thats great, we get pics forever :rofl:
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Hi all
Jesiri went back to the vets today and was signed off..!! He has made a fab recovery and thats been in part to the wonderful people on Purrs, vets and everybody caring.. He is one fab puss, fulll of the zest of life and is now doing so well, without his tail.. He gets round like a springbuck,.. This is him today having some time without his collar that is on h im to stop him taking the stitches of his tail.. Another week or so.. However, leg and pelvis have now healed well, and the longer term outlook is good.. He is one lucky, lucky puss and will now live out his days in the country away from traffic...
THANKS EVERYONE FOR SUCH A HAPPY ENDING... !
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Wonderful wonderful news ;D
Isnt he handsome and am so pleased he has a forever home and wont get hurt any more ;D
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You just wouldn't believe this was the same cat, would you?
Well done for looking after him so well.
:Luv:
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Just Brilliant
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[quote author=canterbury_cats link=topic=6188.msg109966#msg109966 date=1187981996
As for the life of Riley!! Well i hope Mark doesnt mind me mentioning it but last time he dropped at cat off to us, he got lost getting out our driveway!! (sorry!))) Mark.... But we have a long and dark driveway surrounded by woods so its easily done, isnt it#?
[/quote]
No I don't mind at all Sharon :see:
I was a bit embarrassing having to phone you to find me though :evillaugh:
Jesiri looks incredible - one happy ending. I suppose its cats like him that make it all worthwhile ;D
Also, completely offtrack but couldn't help noticing the kitchen - I had never heard of plinth heaters until a few weeks ago - but we are having them in our new kitchen. They are taking out the radiator so the wall can be used for more workspace - really good idea - do they give out much heat? - it says 2.4Kw but not sure if that is enough to heat a big kitchen?
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Well done Jesiri :Luv: :Luv:
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So pleased to hear this, it is wonderful to hear a good outcome.
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Fantastic news :) Am so pleased for him :)
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I thought you would all like to know that Jesiri now has his own purple collar, and ID.. and jumps around the house like a gazelle. He is a very cheeky puss and is getting on with the other elderlycats in the family. He has not been outside yet but has access to the house and isnt in his pen anymore.. You wouldnt really know about his injuries, he does limp every now again when he over does it abit..though. He loves his food and dosnt mind being played roughly, he loves his toys and his bean bag to sleep on.. He is a wonderful, energetic and playful puss and everyone involved in his rescue, and those people from Purrs should feel good about themselves in helping Jesiri on his road to recover. The following is what i wrote for our newsletter that has just been printed.
Using up your nine lives!
It isn’t very often that i write a rehoming column in our newsletter about one particular cat, but this one deserves a special mention.
Only two days after waving goodbye to our dear Baz (featured in our last newsletter) who was the picture of health the day his new owners came and collected him…we took in Jesiri.
Abit of a weird name for a cat i hear you say? Well, as it happens it was all short notice and we had to come up with something quick… My Niece, who is soon to depart to Namibia and Jesiri means “Gold” in Namibian.. So let me tell you about this young ginger tabby cat, with huge yellow eyes.
Jesiri was just another uneutered stray handed into a vets, but he had suffered a great deal after being involved in some kind of road traffic accident (RTAs), indeed all nine lives where used in that one incident i think... Unlike many RTA’s we come across, Jesiri had come off much worse, having a suspected broken pelvis, leg and jaw…. All which turned out to be true, as well as a broken tail... However, it was a full week before we got to hear about his plight and before swift action was needed to literally save him from being put to sleep. Despite Jesiri’s injuries he remained a cat with huge character and charm.. Not aggressive in his pain or at all, just sorrowful eyes and a pleading look was it took to take him on.. The reason he was untreated for so long was the cost of repairing his injuries, at the time reckoned to be around £800.00..
Once again Isobel our Welfare office, immediately got him signed over to our care and to a vet where we assessed his injuries.. Things didn’t look particular hopeful in saving his crushed leg and his pelvis was pretty bad as well.. He was on a drip for a day or so which gave us abit of time to decide what to do…Jesiri’s injuries were not recent, he probably had all those problems for at least two weeks beforehand, how this mite survived in getting himself food and water is abit of a mystery, but he did, and although thin he was not overly so…(indeed he weighed abit more then Baz when he was first brought into our care)… If a cat unfortunately has to loose a leg, its not the end of the world as they adapt very quickly and cope surprisingly well. Losing a front leg it not ideal and having a dodgy pelvis as well does not much help distribute the weight. Jesiri had major problems, but we or the vet didn’t see an option for him but to loose his leg.. Fate was to prove to be Jesiri saving grace, when x-rays revealed that the leg and his pelvis had started to heal, and being such a young puss (no more then one year we would say) his body had started to repair itself. This meant that with rest and reduced activity in time Jesiri would get the use of his leg back again, although no where near perfect and always with a bad limp, he could in essence live a life with four legs rather then three. So Jesiri was neutered, fixed up with dressings, wired his jaw and given plenty of antibiotics before being sent to one of our fosterers for many weeks of TLC..that was over six weeks ago.
Jesiri turns out to have a character of youth; his playfulness and general ability to take all that life has thrown at him make us marvel at his personality. He never once bit or hissed, never got really annoyed, at the constant bandaging (that he has a habit of getting off two seconds after you put them on). In the weeks we have had him in our care, he has put on weight and has inched his way into the fosterers hearts, and there have been a few cats in the last few years that have been in that same position, but this one seems to be firmly placed as staying here with his fosterers, literally. I write this a day before Jesiri goes back into the vets to have his metal fixture removed from his jaw that was broken and also to have his tail removed.. His tail was damaged so much it has become separated from this vertebra and thus there isn’t much chance of it being much use to him in the future.. However, having to loose a tail in place of loosing a leg is perhaps a small price to pay for happy life..
Jesiri, has had an impact on our finances especially only a few weeks after Baz’s high veterinary cost (broken jaw and weeks at the vets, through another RTA). However, it is good to know that we were able to give Jesiri a lifeline where there was none and that’s what rescue is all about. All those people who have so kindly donated money towards his care… Jesiri sends you head butts and purrs for saving his life. As so often in rescue we have limited funds and resources, but hopefully never get to say “no” when some hope exists. I also happend to be a real sucker for hard luck stories and don't give up easily!
I would like to thank Bourne vets who have done such a great job treating Jesiri in some difficult circumstances and also Isobel are welfare officer, who sometimes goes beyond the call of duty when she see’s an animal in distress, despite the fact that being a veterinary nurse she see's this on an almost daily basis.
So as three cats loose their fight for life in one week due to terminal illness or major neglect and suffering, three cats returned to owners from the efforts of our lost and found co ordinator, two direct rehomings, two ferals neutered and returned, twenty three cats and an amazing thirty four kittens rehomed since our last newsletter, Jesiri is a example that we can indeed make a difference.
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Thank you and we thank Jesiri for getting well ;D
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What a lovely article, I hope it has a good effect for you.