Purrs In Our Hearts - Cat Forum UK
Cat General => General Cat Chat => Topic started by: Mark on June 19, 2007, 08:20:21 AM
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At last some good news ;D
http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30200-1271116,00.html
The video is disturbing :'(
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About bloody well time...hopefully it'll go global next.
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great news but i now am physically wretching and feel sick to the bottom of my stomach watching the video. Ive seen the slaughter and skinning of artic foxes and things so not sure why i feel so bad..to early in the morning i think.
that poor bloody dog wagging its tail before the started butchering it alive :'(
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Its heartbreaking Lynn, these "people" don't deserve to live. Its not a cultural thing, its pure greed and heartlessness. How they can sleep at night is beyond me. I really hope there is such a thing as Karma and they pay for their sins.
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Stockpiles of up to 100,000 cat furs!! >:(
I for one will not be buying any chinese products until I hear of a complete ban. We have to be especially careful buying electrical products. We are buying our large screen TV this week and I will make sure it is made in Japan or elsewhere!
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avoiding chinese products is practically impossible i think nowadays...they just make EVERYTHING over there.
Are the likes of japan etc definately not involved with this ?
I agree in principle entirely but they have taken over the world as far as exporting and the amount of things in this house alone that will say "made in china" is shocking (something that has concerned me for a while now)
what about tiwan etc..lot of clothes etc have that made in label ?
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The Phillippines is another offender
There is a lot of info on here
http://www.caft.org.uk/factsheets/cats-and-dogs.html
It seems a lot of trinkets like keyrings are labelled as fake fur but are car or rabbit fur :( - They say the best thing is mnot to buy unless you are 100% sure.
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on that video clip mark did you notice the cat type ornament (looks like a cat curled up sleeping) my granny had one of those and we all presumed it was rabbit fur as thats what it felt like..i am seriously suspicious now :(
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great news but i now am physically wretching and feel sick to the bottom of my stomach watching the video. Ive seen the slaughter and skinning of artic foxes and things so not sure why i feel so bad..to early in the morning i think.
that poor bloody dog wagging its tail before the started butchering it alive :'(
There is a link on the caft website with an unedited version of the Sky video with sound - its appalling.
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Good news, of course - any step in the right direction is worth celebrating! ;D
But I feel a bit sad that it's almost implied that it's more ok with furs from other animals than cats and dogs. And surely that's not the case?! :( Other animals are made to suffer just as much, and for what? So that people can walk around wearing their pelts. (And seriously - I just can't see the attraction! People wearing fur just look silly!)
I am not a vegan or vegetarian, and so I can't claim to have an objection in principle to the killing of animals. But I do think it's absolutely imperative that whenever an animal is killed by a human, for whatever reason, it is done in a humane way. Grrr... I'm just getting angry now!
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I understand what you are saying. No animal has any more or less rights than another, the fur looks better on the animals. Like you, as a meat eater, if they can prove by certification that the fur or leather is a byproduct of slaughter for meat that has been humanely slaughtered, that is a whole different argument. What I strongly object to, is those evil monsters who shackle animals up and hack their skin off whilst they are still alive. Mothers that have their bellies ripped open and their unborn babies skinned alive so evil witches like madonna can show off their wealth. >:(
As you say, any step in the right direction is worth celebrating.
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just came on to have a check before i head out the door and was basicaly going to say exactly what mark said re leather etc being a by product from the food chain.
Mark what was your last comment about ? what animals are being cut open and young removed ?
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I can't remember the name of the animal, but they said coat Madonna was wearing was made from 40 unborn calves that were taken from the mother before birth as the fur os soft and curly at that stage. After they are born, the fur straightens out and isn't worth as much :(
If you can bear it, look at www.furisdead.com
The video shows cats & dogs being brutally killed. They said that many of the cats have collars on which proves that they were once companion animals. There are no laws against this in China. I am even going to stop ordering from my local chinese now as some of their food no doubt comes from there. I know this isn't much in the scheme of things but I wish more people would commit and it would stop. This is the most sickening thing I have ever seen. They should be so ashamed for what they have done and are still doing to these poor animals. http://www.furisdead.com/feat-trentreznor.asp
http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=
http://www.furisdead.com/feat-karakul.asp
http://www.avdmv.com/general/Mao/stopcruaute_bestanden/baby-lamb.jpg
Edit - they are unborn karakul lambs
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oh no i didnt know that..surely not i thought madonna was a vegetarian buddist type person :Crazy:
(ok off to find and protect cody...me no like the thought of wearing soft and curly fur :shify: )
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:'( :'( :'(
I watched it, i have seen before but the way they are transporting and throwing the crates around, i just cant bear it :'(
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About time too
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oh no i didnt know that..surely not i thought madonna was a vegetarian buddist type person :Crazy:
(ok off to find and protect cody...me no like the thought of wearing soft and curly fur :shify: )
Madonna is an egotistical hipocrite. I hope she chokes on her own vomit.
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oh no i didnt know that..surely not i thought madonna was a vegetarian buddist type person :Crazy:
(ok off to find and protect cody...me no like the thought of wearing soft and curly fur :shify: )
Madonna is an egotistical hipocrite. I hope she chokes on her own vomit.
I couldn't have put it better myself Mark.
I've seen some bad, bad things in my life, but I know I couldn't watch any of the videos you've linked to. It may be cowardly but I know they'd haunt me for a good while.
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I've seen some bad, bad things in my life, but I know I couldn't watch any of the videos you've linked to. It may be cowardly but I know they'd haunt me for a good while.
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I can understand people not wanting to watch them. I had to stop 1/2 way through as it is so upsetting. You feel so helpless and have to remind yourself that it isn't a gory horror film, its real events happening to real animals. I just had a bit of an argument with my mum. She said that people shouldn't talk about stuff like that - I told her these things have to be faced otherwise petitions don't get signed and governments don't get forced into taking action. I know there is a long way to go. I really think China should be told they can't host the olympics until they clean up their act. They won't allow Turkey into the EU until it improves so why can't they do they same to China - MONEY - thats all there is to it >:(
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I agree Mark, these things have to be acknowledged. I think the thing that upsets me is that when you see animals hurt, mistreated etc etc they have no concept of why thats happening to them. They are innocent. Just makes it so much worse in my eyes.
Humans hurt other humans - thats just how it seems to be. But what gives them the right to hurt other species needlessly?
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I agree Mark, these things have to be acknowledged. I think the thing that upsets me is that when you see animals hurt, mistreated etc etc they have no concept of why thats happening to them. They are innocent. Just makes it so much worse in my eyes.
Humans hurt other humans - thats just how it seems to be. But what gives them the right to hurt other species needlessly?
The most upsetting video I saw (had to switch off) was a cage full of cats awaiting their fate and one cat was washing another, trying to reasuure it (this has made me cry again)
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the cats were terrible distressed, well as were the dogs but all of them had pupils bulging and ears flat..sheer panic. They are packed into things like lobster pot crates and they had some many in one a guy had to stomp on the lid to shut it >:(
it was the dogs that got me though..about 10 plus dogs cramped into a crate big enough for one normal sized dog..they cant even bite each other coz theres no room to open their mouths, and one poor dog was pinned against the side and looked like his eye would be lost as it was totally rubbed and pushed into the damned crate (had he been rescued)
THe people who work with this type of thing..i understand they see animals entirely differnently to us but dont any of them feel a twinge of anything when they are being so cruel. these crates full of the animals stacked into hundreds of crates on a lorry..they get thrown from top of lorry onto the floor when unloading..how could they, how many died anyway before being slaughted. Does china have a king ? if he were shown this videos wouldnt he feel complelled to stop it.
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I absolutely agree - countries such as China must be made to stop this unnecessary suffering. BUT we must also remember that even in the UK, there are lots of animals living in unacceptable conditions. Even within the relatively affluent countries of the EU, animal welfare laws desperately need to be made stricter. Farm animals are allowed to live in unacceptable conditions, without access to the outside. They are often transported in disgusting ways, and when they are to be slaughtered they are pushed, shoved and stressed until they are in a complete panic. This is no way for an animal, or any being, to be treated. >:(
Don't get me wrong - I think mistreating animals is disgusting and absolutely unacceptable. But we need to remember that countries such as China have a wide range of other problems to battle: poverty, illiteracy, gender discrimination, human rights violations and so on. This is NOT an excuse. But I think it is part of an explanation. And lets not forget that products such as fur are often made for the benefit of people in wealthy countries, i.e. us. If there was no demand, there would be no supply. So we need to focus our attentions on the consumers, as much as the producers.
I hope people don't misunderstand what I'm saying, and send me hate mail... :rofl: I do not condone any form of cruelty whether to animals or people (with the possible exception of sex offenders and people guilty of animal cruelty...). But in my old age, I am trying to learn to be compassionate towards people - although compassion towards animals is a lot easier... :rofl:
Sometimes pure boycots work, but only if there are other job opportunities for the people. The Snow Leopard Trust recognise this; concerned about dwindling numbers of snow leopards in Central Asia, they developed partnerships with local communities to stop hunting of the leopards. In return for help & support with local business opportunities etc, the locals stick to conservation guidelines to safeguard the snow leopard and its habitat. :wow:
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This ban is from 2009!! >:(
Why the hell can't they make it as from now?
How many 1000's of animals will have to be brutally skinned alive between now & then :( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:(
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/afp/20070619/tsc-eu-animals-fur-c2ff8aa.html
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thats just bloody rediculous..why indeed cant they just start as of... >:( <<<< that doesnt really pinpoint the correct emotion really --- tan we need angrier smileys !
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9 years behind America :mad2:
That angry enough Lynn?
Well a petition needs to be started to boycott all Chinese goods until 2009 then.
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Anyone on here know how to start a petition for this?
I nearly watched the video but have not got the stomach for it, what I seen on the news last night brought me to tears, and then the anger followed!!!!!!!!!!
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I didn't see the news. Was it the same video with the dog being chained to the fence wagging its tail? - Thats what makes it even more heartbreaking that the dog trusted the man completely yet little did he know, he was going to be skinned alive. :'(
For man, read scum who should be skinned alive themselves.
I will look for other petitions as unchained, BUAV etc will probably have more going and its better everyone signs the same one rhather than loads of different ones going. I expect over the next few days we will see the campaigners views on the ruling. Again another example of polititians hiding behind red tape. The should have said the ban was straight away - it was too late already.
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I wont watch your links Mark as i have probably already seen some of them, the dog one sounds familiar. Its f :censored:d up and when i get a terminal disease i wouldnt mind going for a trip with a gun or 3.
If you want to test if a fibre is manmade or fur just hold some in a lighter. Acrylics will melt where as fur will smoke and smell horrid.
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Yes it was Mark :(
Although they say the dog was "wagging" its tail, you could see it was more out of fear!
Also showed cats in cages and :censored: trying to hoop them with some sort of wire lasso. Because one cat wouldn't move they were poking it in the head with a metal bar!!!!!!!!!!
The cats were sort of "cuddling" each other out of fear!!! >:( >:( >:(
Please find the petition as something needs to be done!
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If you want to test if a fibre is manmade or fur just hold some in a lighter. Acrylics will melt where as fur will smoke and smell horrid.
I remember reading that somewhere. They say unless you are 100% sure something is synthetic, don't buy it in the 1st placw. There is apparently a company called Nauticalia in the UK that is selling toy cats which are made from real cat fur >:(
I have been thinking so much about this and still can't understand what makes sane people harden enough to do his kind of thing. They should be executed for it.
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Good news indeed, but like everyone has said why wait so long?
And who will there be to make sure that the torture is not carrying on "undercover"?
Perhaps now they will do something to help Chinas other animals, like the poor bears that are made to ride bikes and dance in the name of "entertainment". There was an article about this in a newspaper a little while back, and I happened to say to a work colleague that I hated that :censored: When I told him about the fur trade etc, all he could say was "oh".
Now going to find my baby to give him a cuddle and grieve for all those poor animals. :( :( :(
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I realised tonight I need to be more vigilant with my purchases.
When I got home, I realised I had a typhoon egg pan - made in china >:(
a garden chair - made in china >:( >:(
I will be on my guard in future
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The best way to get China to stop these autorocities (to humans and animals) is to take the bloody Olympics away from them! I do not understand how they can be expected to change their ways when the rest of the world will be throwing hundreds of thousands (probably millions) of $ at them in sponsorship etc to host the games.
I am pleased they are banning pet fur but like has already been said what about the other poor animals ... raccoons, mink, foxes, wolves, beavers, tigers, etc etc etc etc they will also suffer horrid barbaric and cruel deaths. I haven't watched any of the videos that Mark linked to but I have in the past watched the videos on the PETA website .... watching Chinese trappers skinning raccoons alive after partially stunning them with home made electrocution equipment made me physically sick ... the images will stay with me for as long as I live. Although I find the images harrowing I think everyone should see them in order to understand just what really goes on.
I honestly believe there are so many people who genuinely have no idea of what really goes on. Although they themselves would never wear fur they still think that animals used in the fur trade are killed humanely and do not suffer. If only they knew the truth.
RIP all you poor little souls who have suffered at the hands of humans ... on behalf of my species I apologise to you all :'(
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This happens on other animals aswell........
foxes....racoons...chinchillas......monkeys.....otters......mink....stoats.....rabbits.....the list goes on & on ....what about them?
The only ones that should wear fur are the animals
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My mum said that she saw a programme - I don't know which country it was. They beat the dogs while they are alive "to make the meat more tender" :'(
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I dont get these sorts of people! Do they see everything alive as some sort of food source? Surely they must have cow's, chickens etc. Why eat something we regard as pets?
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My mum said that she saw a programme - I don't know which country it was. They beat the dogs while they are alive "to make the meat more tender" :'(
The cat/dog meat trade is as bad as the fur trade :'( i saw something about duck eggs that they incubate and when about to hatch they par boil them and eat it :sick:
In this country im told that pigs are tumbled in big turny things to remove the bristles >:(
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Just caught up with this thread.
Great news except the derral until 2009. I simply don't understand that.
Somebody else made the comparison about their apparant care for Pandas. The Chinese know that the animal most associated with them is the panda and the world links the two together. It is also a tourist money spinner which masks the vile and barbaric fur trade.
I will not knowlingly purchase any Chinese goods or visit Chinese restaurants. I wouldn't have given them the Olympics but now it is going ahead, hopefully some good can come out of it by highlighting the real nature of the Chinese where human life has little value and animal life even less. Better late than never I guess but too many animals wills suffer horrific deaths before the ban is imposed.
What can we do? Express our horror, yes. But PLEASE spread the word and make friends, relatives and work colleagues fully aware. I will watch the video later but have seen similar. I think it is important to watch this stuff, however grotesque and unpallatable, so that you redouble your efforts. Too many animal lovers bury their heads in the sand rather than pass on the word.
Sometimes people ask you What type of animal would you like to be if you come back to earth?My answer is that I wouldn't. I'd like to come back as a deadly virus and selectively wipe out people who are systematically wiping out the animal kingdom and destroying nature.
Keep this in the public eye.
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mark also mentioned not going to chinese restaurants, my only questions on that is would it be fair to the british born or long time residents who run chinese food shops..they probably get their supplys from the same places as all the other multi nationality restaurants (well i would have thought ?)
i totally agree with everything else, only yesterday i had a second hand (nearly new) pair of roller boots delivered and see the label says "made in china" :( I will be checking labels (esp clothing) more closely from now on.
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Its a really difficult one.
As for not being fair to british born or long term residents, I came to the conclusion a long time ago after dealing with "cowboys" and dishonest traders that I don't owe anyone a living. I will be extra careful from now on. My next purchase - today probably will be a printer so I will have to make sure it isn't made in China. I will have to change brands when I upgrade my Hi-fi as I always buy NAD separates but they are "designed in the UK, assembled in China"
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Sometime ago there was a documentary on chinas orphans & while filiming in 1 of the state homes the film crew stumbled on a baby girl left on her own in a cold dark room to die ...just cos she was female, they hold no regard for girls. the film drew was shocked & when they went back next day she was gone & the folk diened all knowledge of her.
Recently they was another documentary on the trade of endangered animals & on the illeagal breeding & killing of tigers for the pelt, there was a film shown taken by a tourist & quite clearly showning a tipper truck driven in to the tigers enclose & the truck was tipped up & a live cow was tipped out & it fell on its belly & got up & you could hear it screeming as it tried to run away from the tigers
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Yes I think I may have seen that too Mags, whats wrong with girls. :-:
There is a petition on here about the tigers and the cruelty going on, its in the Animal petitions section please sign it. :)
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mark also mentioned not going to chinese restaurants, my only questions on that is would it be fair to the british born or long time residents who run chinese food shops..they probably get their supplys from the same places as all the other multi nationality restaurants (well i would have thought ?)
Our local ethnic supply shop is called "Thais are us" :evillaugh:
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The question on the ' british born or long time residents
Observation deleted by Moderator
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in defense of a chinese family who have lived here since i was a small child (when warrens parents ran the place) Although i dont really know them personally i know they are decent and dont have the "same mentality", they are lovely peeps.
I really think we shouldn't tar all with the same brush, china is a massive place.
CC they probably have to pay money when the girls get married to the "in laws" family or something. But also in china its illegal to have more than one child i think (or is it two) and in some areas atleast they are very strict on that law.
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I think more chinese people would against than for this kind of thing. They said on the video that a lot of the cats were wearing collars so were obviously pets stolen from regular chinese people. This is probably a very isolated situation and most people in China would be horrified by it - BUT - as there are no laws against it, the authorities need to have pressure put on them to get laws in place to stop it AND punish the offenders - we know China is very good at punishment.
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The question on the ' british born or long time residents
They have the same mentality
I can certainly say they do not. I am half chinese and I'm really starting to consider leaving this forum as this is the second time all ethnically Chinese people have been labelled cat eaters of pet haters. I never thought that I could experience such small mindedness and racism on a place I did up until recently consider a great place to talk about cats.
For the record - I have never eaten cat - nor know anyone who has - I have also never worn fur of any kind!
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Lyn Su please dont leave the forum, if you read all the posts you will see that atleast some of us have said that ALL are not the same. The sweeping generalisations upset me aswell but unfortunately in life some people really do believe such to be true. However i dont think its an example of how we all feel and i'd be very upset to see you go, esp on the grounds of racism.
Personally you can do far more good by staying and educating people to allow them to have much more balanced opinions.
:hug:
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i have just re read posts and realised a fundamental spelling mistake i made in my own .. i do hope you realised my mistake which i will now modify but should have read as
I really think we should SHOULDN'T tar all with the same brush, china is a massive place.
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We know exactly what you meant Lynn :evillaugh:
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No-one is more appalled than I am by the barbaric treatment afforded to animals in China - and elsewhere - but Lyn Su is right to protest that it is wrong to assume all people of similar ethnic backgrounds have the same views, on this or any other matter.
We must continue to debate this dreadful, dreadful treatment of sentient beings, but please let us avoid racism and prejudice. Thanks guys.
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I agree with Lynn....there is good and bad in every culture and we can't tar everyone with the same brush. The fur trade is absolutely sickening and the peeps who do this want stringing up by their genitalia but we also have some cruel :censored: in our country, for eg kids who throw cats off balconies, kids throwing cats onto the motorway, :censored: hanging someones pet dog and then setting fire to it.........does that make us all "evil :censored: ", I think not. Sadly though, until the fur trade stops and cats are seen for what they are, a living, feeling being, the chinese will continue to be targeted.
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Agreed Christine. We've moderated some threads before for some comments which are taken out of context and could hurt others please lets keep this friendly to each other (we do after all come to Purrs as our home away from home) and avoid sweeping and generalising comments.
China is targetted yes, but so should many other countries be who devastate the animal kingdom with acts of cruelty.
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Here is some positive news. An article from earlier this year where a chinese animal rights movement saved 400 cats from a market
http://www.guardian.co.uk/china/story/0,,2011569,00.html
Here is not good news - very graphic pictures. I know some people don't want to see this but people need to realise what is happening. The article said that due a lot of people being affluent, eating cat meat is on the increase. It needs to be stopped.
http://sirius.2kat.net/cats.html
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Lyn-Su please accept my apologies if I anyway made you think I regard all chinese as cat-killers ... I totally agree with not tarring everyone with the same brush. One of the ladies I work with is chinese she is the pround mummy of two beautiful kitties, a mad little staffy who thinks she's a cat, and she is also a vegitarian.
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I can understand the pain here and i just couldn't face seeing your links Mark or barely able to read all the posts about whats in them. I have nightmares still from being a memeber of Animal aid and had to leave from being in a state of always crying. But as others have been saying we can't tar a whole countries people with the same cruel brush. I am half German and sadly the word "German" is still seen alot in England as bad race. It is the 1st thing i get whenever i meantion my fathers home country. I'ts the same for every single country in the world, every one has crulty weather human or animal form but thank god there is also good trying to fight the bad too.
What happens when we have a thread of cruelty like this one is we all are hurt and absolutely shocked by what is happening to the animals and anger is a natural state we express against the people who are committing it. If this thread was about people in another country the reactions would be no different. It's the evil people committing the crime no matter where they are that needs to be targeted in a way we might be able to help stop it.
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those photos were indescribable mark :'(
I just cant help myself from looking at such things, its like unless i do it doesn't sink in that such barbaric atrocities happen >:(
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I think we need to see them to prove it really happens. When I saw the cats in the cages I tried to imagine if it were mine. When I think that they are crammed in cages, fed a bowl of rice and some "animal feed" (god knows whats in that - if people are going to kill & eat them, I hope its slow-acting poison) and to suffer the fate. I keep saying it but the video of the cat in the cage where one cat was licking another to reassure it is probably more upsetting than the gruesome pictures. I think this has affected me more than anything. I know I may be criticised for this, but it along the lines of sadistic concentration camps. I want to find out more and get actively involved. i want to find out if all the TV stations in the world have this footage so the whole world knows whats going on there.
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I know I may be criticised for this, but it along the lines of sadistic concentration camps.
In my opinion, Mark, you are right - it is when we lose empathy for others, human or animal, that atrocities happen.
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I found this quote the other day and posted on another thread and it is so true
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing". Edmund Burke
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I notice 1 person on here has made racial coments, and this is not the first, why has nothing been done as it isnt right!
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I have asked for people to desist from racism and I have moderated one post. Would you PM me, CC, and let me know which comment I may have missed? Thanks.
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A few more threads have been moderated. While i agree any awful cruelty anywhere including England mustn't be hidden from public sight, we need to consider the good people form all over the world who adore animals and human life. Please becareful with your posts. Thanks.