Purrs In Our Hearts - Cat Forum UK
Cat Health & Behaviour => Health & Behaviour General => Topic started by: Millys Mum on February 12, 2007, 17:08:49 PM
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A couple of weeks back George started acting strangely, stopped going out, didnt jump on the work tops, wandering, starting fights with the other cats, staring at walls and was a bit wobbly on his feet.
We went to the vets who did a full check over. His teeth were pretty bad and thought that the oral pain may be causing his odd behaviour. 10 days of Antirobe (finished course yesterday) made an improvement until saturday when his old behaviour returned. The vet now thinks he has something "going on between his ears".
Tomorrow they are running full bloods for everything and doing a liver test. There are some viruses that it could be. After that referal to a neurologist for MRI scans etc basic package is £1600 so im hoping Marks & Sparks are prompt.
Anybody have any ideas i could research?
Hes only 4years old ish and to see him like this is killing me.
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So sorry that George has problems and hope they can find out what is causing them, cuddles top George and I hope M&S are quick, please let us know :hug: :hug:
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A worrying time, Milly's Mum, but try not to think the worst (as always, I know this is easy for me to say :hug:). Let us know how the little fella gets on tomorrow.
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Good luck for tomorrow, i hope it all goes well. It could be a variety things but i hope it`s something easily fixed.
An MRI is a good way to go if all the bloods come back normal. There are various liver problems that can show as neurological signs but usually these are present from birth so would have showed up earlier than 4 years but you never know.
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Fingers crossed for him.
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Thanks for good wishes :Luv: :thanks:
Well hes had his blood samples taken, he must have behaved as only bald on one side with one hole. The inhouse profile was fine, which is good, i was kinda hoping for something to stick out tho,just to make it easy.
They have sent away a Bile Acid test, have to wait 5-7 days for that :-[
Amanda, do you have any suggestions as to the liver problems? I know of shunts but all info i find on them are for kittens, nothing says an adult cat cant hide the signs tho.
Do you know if ammonia would be on the inhouse bloods? As i have read that can cause his symptoms.
Watching him for the next week while his results are pending is going to be horrible, i dont think hes in any pain but its quite distessing to see him so vacant. My mum has got quite upset at times.
PS. Does anybody know where Lyn is??
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PS. Does anybody know where Lyn is??
I was told that she has computer problems !
Fingers crossed for George, it is horrible when one of our babies isnt well.
give him big kiss from me X
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I was told that she has computer problems!
No point in sending an email then! Lol
George says thanks for the kiss! :angel:
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Poor George, I hope you can get to the bottom of what's causing his problems. He is a very handsome young man, Tiggy was going to send a healing head kiss but now she has seen his pic she'd like it to be a nose kiss :Luv:
Might be worth emailing Lynn as I know last time she had computer problems she could still pick up some emails via her mobile.
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Aww, he is lovely - good luck for the rest of the tests.
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Nose kiss accepted :Luv:
Iv been thinking hard about his behaviour and have realised its been a week since he purred or sat on my lap (he's normally glued to it) and hasnt been upstairs or on the sofa.
It really sucks. If he keeps gping downhill this quickly i wont have much choice left :-[
Cant say hes got any quality of life at the moment
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Aww, fingers crossed they can get to the bottom of it quickly, he is only young.
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Im speaking to vet tomorrow to see how long it takes to get referred, if its weeks i wont know what to do!
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Good luck with Georges tests, I hope they can do something to help him improve his quality of life.
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These are random ideas.
Could it be poisoning, from house plants, or cleaning products?
Or he could be having simple-partial seizures, in which case the diazepam would help.
Is the vet running an EEG? This is a test for epilepsy, which can present in the way you describe.
I hope he is treated and better soon. :best:
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Thanks for your input hippykitty, he has had bloods done that show his kidneys to be fine and theres no vomiting so poisoning has been written off.
I think the EEG would be done by the referal place, he hasnt had any fits, flicking eyes or muscle tremours but i will ask vet again about epilepsy.
Hes just been out and was sniffing where the toms leave their odour and he tried to spray, not alot came out and he immediately washed himself (hes a very lazy cat and normally cant be bothered, lets himself air dry lol) so im now thinking maybe he has pain from bladder stones. Being an over weight male neter. He wont use a tray, i havent seen any wet patches but if theres one thing iv learnt about ill cats is that they dont always follow the text book.
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Have you spoken to the vet yet, Millys Mum or is that later on?
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The vet dealing with George wasnt available, so had a chat with a different one.The guy is back in tomoro so im to phone first thing.
I gave some Metacam and theres a good response so hes got pain somewhere.
Iv had lap time with purring so im pleased with that :)
nhjgftrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr that was george jumping onto my lap, something he hasnt done in a week :)
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I gave some Metacam and theres a good response so hes got pain somewhere.
nhjgftrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr that was george jumping onto my lap, something he hasnt done in a week :)
Yes, looks like it, doesn't it? I hope the source and cause of the pain can be found quickly :hug:
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I agree he must have been in pain for that spectacular reaction...........do hope they can find the cause quickly :hug:
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This is good news then I guess, while it's awful to know he must have been in pain the fact that he's responded so well to the metacam is fantastic. Hope you can get to the bottom of what's causing this and get George back to normal ASAP.
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Good to hear that he's back on your lap. Hope George feels better soon and hope you do too.
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I have vets permission to carry on with Metacam, so atleast i dont have to watch him meandering while his bloods are done, should get the result on Monday. Then get to decide on referring him or not. I would have to get him from Essex to Newmarket (Animal Health Trust).
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Sorry, I'm arriving rather late to the party BUT...
Ollie, my (accidentally rather long-term) foster, has very severe neurological issues (circling, falling, that horrible neuro cat howl, the whole works) which disappear almost COMPLETELY with a large dose of steroids injected subcutaneously about every fortnight. I've now learnt to do these at home as Ollie objects really very strongly indeed to the cat carrier (!) - which is actually a complete doddle, even with dodgy hands. Vet showed me how and then I did the next couple under supervision, and now I've got a stash of syringes and needles (sterile) and a sharps bin at home and Ollie's quality of life is really pretty good at the moment.
It's thought that his neuro symptoms are secondary to a brain tumour (no MRI for Ollie von Ollifer due to nobody being able to afford it; it'd probably only tell us what is already obvious - that he's got something his brain causing inflammation - and you'd only treat that with steroids anyway) - but I've really not seen much progression in the time I've had him so hopefully he's going to enjoy a good few stable years yet.
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Better late than never Rebecca! Lol. All input is v.much appreciated.
Whats the name of the steroid? A jab every so often would be better than a daily dose i guess.
Im glad to have him insured so that every option is possible.
Hes doing ok on the metacam so it gives me time to think properly without the pressure of deciding quickly incase hes suffering. My head is now not so :Crazy: :Crazy:
Good to hear your Ollie is stable :)
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Where in Essex are you Milly`s Mum?
If you feel he is getting worse then he can be referred as an emergency to a neurologist. I have a cat that went through similar tests to George to eliminate different things as she had a lot of neurological signs. As you probably already know the bile acid stim test will help them see if it is a liver shunt but as you have found from looking for information on it it is usually diagnosed in kittens/very young cats. You`d expect some of the liver enzymes to be slightly raised if it was to do with that but i guess you`ll find out on Monday. I think that an MRI sounds like a very good idea and if he seems to be deteriorating then you might need to go asap.
How is he at the moment?
Also, as far as i know ammonia is not one of the tests that is included in a general biochemistry blood test but your vet may do this, it just depends on what blood machine they use.
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I`ve just been having a look in one of my feline nursing books to see if i can come up with anything that might help.
In the neurological section there are two main sections. The first one includes things like spinal cord damage and things like that which would sort of fit with the improvement with Metacam but other signs don`t really fit with this. It says that other signs will include problems urinating/defaecating and deficits with the limbs such as placement problems etc. From doing a thorough neurological examine the vet should be able to tell roughly where in the spinal cord the problem is.
The second section is about central neurological problems. The most common ones being infectious agents so it recommends that tests are done for FIV/FeLV/FIP & Toxoplasmosis. Other causes can be trauma, encephalitis (you would usually notice this due to the swelling starting on the forehead), thiamine deficiency (but if he is having a complete diet then this is unlikely) or liver related problems. The main liver problem mentioned is liver shunt which it says is mostly diagnosed in cats under one. The other thing that might be worth looking into is lysosomal storage disease which is what my cat ended up having. Where the body stores up chemicals that it should be getting rid of. Other possibilites could include epilepsy and things like tumours which it`s probably best that we don`t think about at this early stage.
Fingers crossed for his results on Monday.
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Millie's Mum - he is on Prednisolone (spelling?) - v common steroid also used in humans. And yes Ollie is by vet agreement 'not a candidate for pills' eg he nearly took the vet's hand off when he tried :-: but the jabs works great so I'm happy. 4 months now, and counting.
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Hi Amanda, thanks for getting back to me.
Im in Colchester, an hour and abit away from AHT.
My vet said 10 days to be referred but they will see you next day if its urgent.
He's doing well on metacam, is still missing that sparkle from his eyes but he's definatley less wobbly and isnt wandering/staring as much either. Has been chasing sticks in the garden today :)
He eats a complete wet food/ raw extras so i wouldnt think hes thiamine deficiant.
The vet checked his responses to light/knowledge of where his legs are.
With lysosomal storage disease would bloods show anything as raised? As his inhouse results were fine.
Iv prepared myself for him having a tumour especially with his response to the metacam, theres pain and/or swelling in him somewhere.
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Fingers crossed it is something less serious.
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Hi Millys Mum and very soft headbutts to the very beautiful (excuse me) handsome George.
Just wanted to say I have been responsible for many of the adverse comments about Metacam on this site recently but wanted to say how magical the stuff can be as shown by George's reaction to it. Chasing sticks in the garden is pretty fantastic. Very best wishes to your lovely boy.
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Milly`s Mum, i know it`s difficult sometimes not to think the worst but hopefully it`s something they can sot out. I would see about going for referral quite quickly if possilbe just in case there is something starting that may need to be treated by specialists quickly. I have my fingers crossed for you that it isn`t any sort of tumour although sometimes they can treat these depending on the sort.
My cat had the initial bloods in house at the vets which were all normal. then bile acid stim test which was also normal. She then went for a referral to a neurologist in Wimbledon. It was tricky because she was found as a stray and had only had one small seizure. i knew she was a bit special as she walks with a swagger and and some things she does are over exaggerated. Other than that she was coping well when i first got her so i didn`t want to have too many invasive tests done on her but at the same time i wanted to try and get a diagnosis in case there was something that might stop things from progressing. She had an MRI which was all normal so whilst she was under anaesthetic they did some further tests which showed some abnormalities with her muscles and the time it took them to respond. They did a muscle biopsy which was only a small procedure and sent it to America for testing. This didn`t show too much. At this stage they were looking to do nerve biopsies but i didn`t want this as it was much more invasive. They said they had one other idea which was to culture some of her skin (don`t ask me why, it`s all a bit hard to understand!!) and thats what showed she had the lysosomal storage disease. There is no treatment for it and there are different kinds so it all depends on these things to know the outcome. You can give supplements such as fatty acids which are meant to help a bit but i wouldn`t worry about all that at the moment!
Keep us posted on how things are going.
Also, i`ve just had a look and that is your neareast referral vets but you may already know this! :)
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Do hope that you can get George checked out quick................he sounds remarkable, chasing sticks LOL..............try not to think the worst cos there are many treatments out there if they can see him quick enough :hug: :hug: :hug:
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Not long til results time, i hope its today and not tomorrow!
Im blocking the garden off today. Iv been escorting George on his outdoor trips but yesterday he managed to slip away :scared: He was gone for several hours before i spotted him staring through the fence at the bottom of the neighbours garden. My mum went and rescued a rather confused and upset George :( He had gone through a gap but couldnt work out the reverse journey home
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He got up a little while ago and has done nothing but wander and get stuck behind furniture, the stress of yesterdays trapping has really upset him.
He was bad after his vet trip for his blood tests and my mum is now worried if we refer him the stress of the day out will send him over the edge. She wants his time to be calm & peaceful.
Dilema.
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Sorry to hear that he got himself lost and confused yesterday and had to be caught. :(
my mum is now worried if we refer him the stress of the day out will send him over the edge.
Yes, it is a dilemma. Perhaps the results of the tests (hope they come today) will help suggest the best course of action?
A gentle ear tug from me to George, meanwhile.
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Poor George, strokes to him from me :hug:
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Hope George has settled down by now, keeping everything crossed for the test results. Healing head kiss being sent to the lovely George from Tiggy :Luv:
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I do hope he has settled down a bit, and that the test results show something promising. IT is a hard decision whether to refer to specialists.
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Have the test results come through yet?
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I hope the blood results reveal something so that you don't need to make the referral decision.
If he were my cat, I'd go ahead with the referral if no joy with the tests. If you keep him calm and reassured on the journey, the visit may be worth the stress. He's going through a lot of stress with his condition, so a journey which may resolve his problems would be worth it.
That's how I'd think if he were mine.
But you know him, and know what's best.
Lots of flirty, comforting kisses from Samantha, and that flirt, Polly :Luv: :blow kiss:
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He's worse today :( had a double dose of metacam last night to improve things and it hasnt helped. The results still aren't here either.
Before i left for work this morning he was walking through the water bowl in the kitchen and then slipping on wet feet, so i laid a towel out for him. When i got home i found him in the shoe rack, eyes wide open but nobody home. He wouldnt respond to his name and it wasnt until i touched him that he realised i was there, then panic as he couldnt get out of the shoe rack quick enough, having burst out he ended a couple of stairs up and then nearly fell down. Im really unhappy with him and feel whatever is wrong with him is progressing so quickly that iv made the decision to have him pts at home tomorrow morning. :'( :'( :'(
Hes beating up the other cats and for a normally laid back friendly kitty i can only assume he is unhappy/uncomfortable.
I really thought the anti imflammortory/painkiller combination would keep him comfy but its not :'(
Thank you all for your help
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I am so sorry for poor George, I dont know what to say, poor little man its so sad :hug: :hug: :hug: :hug: to you both
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I am really sorry to hear this, MM.
xC
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I'm sorry that his condition has deteriorated so badly.
The "eyes wide open and nobody home" is typical of a type of epilepsy now called 'simple partial' but once called 'petite mal' or 'absences'. He loses awareness of his surroundings for a few minutes, and won't respond to you, looking vacant and 'not there'. Then he'll act oddly as he comes out of it, doing strange things (like walking in circles). He may feel tired when he properly comes out of it, or continue to have waves of more seizures in which he'll feel strange and be vaguely aware of his surroundings.
If properly diagnosed, this can be easily controlled with medication. The best med for cats is diazepam. Many anti-epilepsy drugs can't be used in cats because they eliminate them too quickly, but I've read on the internet that diazepam is safe and effective. It's used for people with this condition.
The reason I know about this is that I have a related condition: 'complex partials', which begin with a simple partial, then I lose consciousness and fall. The first thing friends notice is the "nobody home" state. Naturally, I've done lots of research related to this illness.
If you've made a definite decision to pts, then my heart goes out to you, I know how hard this can be. :'(
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Oh how sad ... would you consider treating for epilepsy before you decide to PTS?
Big hugs :hug: :hug: :hug:
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So very sorry to hear this Millys mum. :hug:
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Unfortunately Vet doesnt think its epilepsy, although the specialist would test for it. He doesnt have any type of fit, hes in a constant daze, its not an on & off thing. :( Epilepsy also wouldnt respond to Metacam like he initally did.
Sometimes its like hes blind, walking through things and not being able to place his feet in the right place. I dont think he can cope with a stay at newmarket. Its causing him great distress so i know tomorrow is the best thing.
Knowing when to stop is the hardest thing!
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I am so sorry things are looking so bad - have you talked through this decision with the vet just in case he can offer some alternative? It truly is so hard to decide how far to try treatments that have no guarantees of working, the only thing I would be tempted to do is hold fire until the test results are back just in case they do show something treatable/manageable, but that really is your choice, you are the one living with him. We are all here if you need support and advice, sadly there are quite a few of us on here who have been in a similar position.
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I'm really sorry to hear about George, it must have beeing heartbreaking for you to find him like that and I can certainly understand you wanting to end his distress. Sending :hug: from me and the crew.
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Milly`s Mum, i`m so sorry to hear that things aren`t going well. You are right, it is so hard to know how far to go. If he is getting a lot worse then i suppose the only thing you can do is either end his discomfort or go to Newmarket tomorrow as an emergency and see if the neurologist has any suggestions.
My thoughts are with you, it`s such an awful decision to have to make.
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Sorry to hear this sad news, will be thinking of you tomorrow :hug:
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My heart goes out to you and George! Giant hugs and prayers being sent!
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He's gone :'(
This morning he wasnt even responding to his name, barely lifting his head when walking and didnt want to eat so i stayed with the plan. He got stuck in the vegetable rack, the stress on his face when he couldnt get where he wanted put me off putting him through more tests, had the Metacam continued to work or if i could have referred him without waiting for liver test results then i would have gone with him. The rapid 48hr deterioration makes me believe he had something terminal anyway.
Im gutted to have lost him so young. He was my loving lap cat, who we saved from the streets, 2 1/2 years wasnt long enough.
Id like to buy a plaque for the garden, does anybody knows of any places online?
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Millys mum, I'm so sorry. We had to make the same decision for Parsley recently and it's utterly heartbreaking.
I've been looking for a plaque too and have found some on EBay, so you might want to look on there.
Please PM me if you feel the need to.
RIP, George. You were loved by your humans very much.
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So sad, RIP little one, play hard on the Bridge sweetheart.
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:'( :'( So sorry MM.
RIP George ... no more pain or confusion baby.
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RIP George, have a great time on the Bridge and look for Kocka cos she will give you a helping paw.
I am so sorry MM
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Thank you all :group:
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MM I'm so sorry. You know in your heart you did the right thing for poor George. :hug:
Here are a couple sites that offer the services you enquired about:
http://www.houseandgardenplaques.co.uk/
http://www.pet-memorial.net/
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:hug:
So sorry to hear about George - bet he's having a great game with the Proot by now...
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Thanks Kittybabe.
I had a good blub when i buried him and am now suffering with dry itchy eyes that feel like this :Crazy:
I found yesterday the worse day emotionally because of having to decide what to do and then the hours up to the imminent event.
My food cupboard is tailored to his desires, the others eat whatever you put in front of them, so its weird feeding them, i no longer need to deliberate & think "well he had fish for breakfast so he better have meaty" i just have to take one. (The quicker the better says Lola!)
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Sorry Milly's Mum,
It must have been so difficult for you but you did what was best for George, that's the main thing.
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I`m so sorry to hear this Milly`s mum but it sounds like you made the right decision and you`ve done everything that you could for him although i know this doesn`t ease the pain you must be feeling right now.
Cambridge Pet Crematorium do some nice plaques http://www.cpccares.com/ They aren`t shown on their site at the moment but i think if you phone them they will send you some details.
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I am so sorry to hear he was worse and you had to make that decision. While it is never an easy thing to decide, it is harder in these situations where you simply dont know what is going on, and dont know if you should wait and see if they recover or not - I always find the the day before/the day of the worst as well, I feel better afterwards as I know they are no longer suffering. At least he had a good life while with you, and also that he had someone strong enough to let him go peacefully and painlessly at the right time. RIP little one, and big hugs to you - I am here if you need to talk
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:hug: to you and your family, you gave George the greatest gift in the end when the time came and put his feelings before your own. My Benji will take care of him on the Bridge until you come for him x
Someone on Purrs had one of these plaques made when they lost their beloved cat, they are hand made and personalised. They even paint a little figure on the plaque to look like the one you have lost, they can be outdoor varnished if requested too...
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/PET-MEMORIAL-DOG-CAT-RABBIT-PERSONALISED-ANGEL-FIGURE_W0QQitemZ290084332039QQihZ019QQcategoryZ46299QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
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I heard from the vet today that his bloods came back strongly indicating FIP, so there was no way out of this for my baby boy.
I wasnt happy doing the deed before his results were in but i had a gut feeling he was terminal.
I feel better now i have an answer to all my neverending questions and what ifs and buts.
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:hug: MM.
At times like this, it is at least something to have an answer. One of my colleagues recently had to have her little one PTS because of FIP at the age of 12 months. You did the right thing for George.
xC
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Milly`s Mum I know just how you feel, think human nature makes us beat ourselves up until we have answers I did just the same over Cringle recently.
Of one thing I am certain George had a wonderful life with you and you made the right decision at the right time.
:hug:
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Your gut did you and George a favour, you must be so relieved that you know that there was no hope and George has gone to Rainbow Bridge without suffering any more :hug: :hug: :hug: :hug:
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So sorry to hear about George :( :hug: RIP George.
FIP is a horrible disease and you did the right thing by relieving his suffering before it got any worse. He's at peace now and will romping around Rainbow Bridge with my Magpie and the other bridge babes.
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:) @ Gill, its good my guts are useful for something other than grumbling for more grub.
Its really helped being able to talk things through here :thanks:
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Like I said on the other thread, I am sorry that the vet suspects FIP, it isn't a pleasant disease, and with that kind of diagnosis, you did the only thing you could do for him - it is just so hard to make that decision when you dont know what is wrong with them, and you are desperately hoping that your gut feeling is wrong. I am glad you have had some kind of answer and it has made you feel better about the decision you made.
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George is now happily playing on the Bridge. You did the right thing; he would have been in a lot of pain. Take care of yourself. :hug: