Purrs In Our Hearts - Cat Forum UK
Cat General => Our cats stories => Topic started by: Linda (Bengalbabe) on June 17, 2008, 19:05:23 PM
-
Just wanted to share these with you. A friend of mine is just fab with photshop :Luv:
(http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w196/bengalbabe_2007/minerva.jpg)
(http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w196/bengalbabe_2007/kaiser.jpg)
-
They are great ;D
-
:Luv2: :Luv2: :Luv2: :Luv2: :Luv2: :Luv2: :Luv2: :Luv2:
-
No....I am greedy just want them all to myself! :sneaky: :Luv: :Luv:
-
They are fab! :Luv2:
-
I'll post you a big jiffy bag later Linda so you can send the gorgeous Minerva, Kaiser, Dite and Rainbow up to me :evillaugh:
The photoshop images are absolutely amazing and really show off Kaiser and Minerva beautifully. I simply love the one with Kaiser's beautiful head faded into the background :Luv2: :Luv2:
-
They're fab ;D
-
Gorgeous, I can say silvers are my fave though. :Luv:
-
Kaisers eyeliner is great on that faded picture ;D
-
Wow - those photos are fantastic.
-
superb Linda :Luv2:
-
How did I miss this?!!!!!! :drool; :drool; :drool; :drool; :drool; :drool;
-
Thanks Everyone :Luv:
-
I dont often say this. In fact I never have.
But those 2 cats are simply stunning.
Kaiser looks just like an Asian Leapord Cat.
-
amazing cats, i think Disney should make a movie and feature them - stunning
your friend is a photoshop genius :)
-
When I saw this was a thread started by Linda Bengalbabe, I was prepared for some serious stunning pictures.... and I was not disappointed!!
Your cats are beyond beautiful... photoshop or not!
I could just look at those pics forever !
-
Kaiser looks just like an Asian Leapord Cat.
That's because Kaiser is an F1, his father is an ALC and Minerva is an F2 ;)
-
Please Ruth can you explain these to me again cos have forgotten what they mean.......sigh
-
Kaiser looks just like an Asian Leapord Cat.
That's because Kaiser is an F1, his father is an ALC and Minerva is an F2 ;)
Aaaaah. Now that makes sense.
Do you have any other pics of him. They would be great to see.
Thanks.
-
Foundation 1 (right Linds?) Kaiser's father is an Asian Leopard Cat and his mother would have been a later generation bengal. So Kaiser lad is a first generation offspring of the ALC. Minerva is the offspring of a F1 bengal (like Kaiser) and another later generation bengal so a Foundation 2 (hopefully Linda can confirm).
You can see the features so clearly. Kaiser has so many similar features to his daddy :Luv2:
-
Please Ruth can you explain these to me again cos have forgotten what they mean.......sigh
So, in summary,
F1: parent was an Asian Leopard Cat
F2: grand parent was an Asian Leopard Cat
F3: great grand parent was an Asian Leopard Cat
...and so on.
Obviously the lower the F number, the closer the cat will be (genetically) to its wild ancestor (Asian Leopard Cat for Bengal, Serval for Savannah). The F1s are generally larger than SBTs.
At F5 level (SBT) the cat is classed as fully domestic.
Do you need a license to own a F1, in the UK?
-
Yep, thats right, and most cat registries wont let you show anything earlier than F4, whic is classed as domestic. not sure if you need a licence, but anything earlier than F4 isn't recommended unless you have experience, although I can't fully remember why. They are featured in thsi months Your Cat magazine.
-
Experience or no, I would do anything to just much on Kaiser's belly :naughty: Scumptious little boy. Bengly Palace is heaven, I must find a way to go visit so I can munch on all these times and come home with Lenny :naughty:
-
Thanks for the info and Sunama you made it very easy for my one brain cell ;D
-
Thanks everyone, glad you like my babies :Luv:
You absolutely need a licence for an ALC. Whether or not you need one for an F1 depends on your local council to whom you have to apply and pay a fee. They will inspect the facilities you intend to keep you cat in and whether or not these are suitable. Most dont ask for licences to be held for F2 onwards now.
Ruth, you are spot on with Minerva and Kaisers parentage. Kaisers daddy is Minervas grand-daddy :) Apollo of Gayzette (ALC).
Of course i also have my new F1 girl Dite too - shes the most loving affectionate kitten i have ever brought home - simply amazing :-)
The bengal cat club of great britain have recently changed their rules to allow F2/3s to be exhibited at shows. F4 ownwards can be entered in the actual show classes of course.
-
Sunama - Another pic of Kaiser :Luv:
(http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w196/bengalbabe_2007/P1010086.jpg)
-
Nummmmmmies..!!!
-
Dite? Ok I am just losing it or is this a new one ;D
-
Aphrodite, Gill. The cutest little bengal kitten to date. :Luv:
http://www.purrsinourhearts.co.uk/index.php/topic,15351.0.html
-
Ahhhh right didnt recognize the abbreviation thanks ;D
Her a bengal there a bengal , everywhere is bengals :rofl: :rofl:
-
LOL Gill, keep up :evillaugh:
-
I must
plot make plans to nab visit these little ones :Luv:
-
F1....Its a sign!!! :car: :car: :car: :heeee heeee:
-
Sunama - Another pic of Kaiser :Luv:
(http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w196/bengalbabe_2007/P1010086.jpg)
His markings are very similar to my Egyptian Mau's:
(http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/ii139/sunama123/25beb4cf.jpg)
Kaiser's father is an ALC. Can I ask what breed his mother was?
Also do you have any other breeds of cat, or do you specialise in Bengals only?
I'm quite interested in the Savannah breed, though as yet, there is no breeding program for them in the UK.
-
There's lady breeding Savannahs down near Dover
http://www.savannahcats.me.uk/
-
There's lady breeding Savannahs down near Dover
http://www.savannahcats.me.uk/
Thanks for the link.
Ive checked out the site. They seem to have some (F6) kittens available, though most of them are girls. I prefer boys. What I'm really after is an F2 or F3 and I dont mind waiting till the right one comes along. Right now, due to the lack of breeding in the UK of Savannahs there isnt much choice. I'm sure this will change over the next year or so.
-
I'm not very well up on genetics as it's nearly forty years since I studied it. What does the F2/3/F5 business denote? I realise savannahs are hybrids but I always thought that hybrids were sterile. It's obvious that I really should have been paying more attention on the lessons rather than daydreaming
-
Well, for me, its basically about a more exotic look, but more importantly, the closer the cat is to the Serval, genetically, (ie. lower F-number), the more physical it is likely to be. Eg. the Savannah's are known to be fantastic jumpers, so are stronger than the typcial domestic cat. They have long legs, so have a taller appearance. With each successive generation going away from the Serval, the cat will generally get smaller until they reach the typcial size of a domestic cat. I like active, physical cats and I'm not into the cutsey wootsey look, but thats just me.
Savannah F1,2 & 3s are said to be very dominant cats.
If you look at some of the piccies, you also notice that the F1s and F2s have different faces, compared to the higher F-numbered cats. Take a look at Kaiser's face. It looks very different to a SBT Bengal. It is obvious to even the layman that Kaiser is different to that of a typical Bengal.
So, in summary, the lower F-number, gives you a cat that has a more exotic/different/unique look that you know hardly any other cat will have. Also you have the physical factor (if you want a physical cat, that is).
With regards to sterility Savannah males are sterile for the first 3 generations F1, F2, F3, which is good for those of us who would like a male as a pet as they wont interfere with the breeding program.
-
Hi Sunama
Kaisers mum was an SBT Bengal however in the early days egyptian maus were often used in the bengal breeding programme ;) I have a silver F4 girl here and can see lots of egyptian mau in her - both appearance and physically.
I only have bengals, I adore them and dont plan to expand what i do. You are absolutely correct in your thinking on the savannah cats. There are very little being bred in the UK at the moment however i am aware of a number of bengal breeders who are now importing early generation and sbt savannahs in to the UK hence in a year or so i would expect them to be more readily available.
-
This all so interesting but whats a SBT please ;D
-
This all so interesting but whats a SBT please ;D
I think Standard Bengal/British Tabby - not 100% sure.
-
"Stud Book Tradition" cat.
"A term designated by TICA, The International Cat Association. SBT indicates that the Bengal is pedigreed (yes an oxymoron because a Bengal is a hybrid) and must be at least 4 generations removed from the Asian Leopard Cat. To be an SBT there must only be Bengal to Bengal breeding. No longer does the Bengal standard allow outcrosses."
Basically its just a way of saying its considered a normal, traditional, domesticated breed of cat. Obviously an F1 Bengal, for example, has a lot of Asian Leopard Cat in it. Just look at the 2nd picture of Kaiser that Linda posted. It is obvious that his face doesnt look like a typical Bengal domestic cat. No special licenses are needed for an SBT and it is considered to be a domestic cat.
-
Just out of curiosity, is it possible to tell from a pedigree what F number a cat is. How can you tell the difference between a standard bengal and an egyptian mau?
-
Just out of curiosity, is it possible to tell from a pedigree what F number a cat is.
You mean just by physically looking at a Bengal cat or by looking at its pedigree chart?
How can you tell the difference between a standard bengal and an egyptian mau?
There are physical and character differences between the 2 breeds, just like you will find differences between any 2 breeds.
From my own 2, I can tell you
Egyptian Mau:
generally smaller,
they have spots,
if you shave them they are the only domestic cat in the world that will have spots on their skin,
they are the fastest domestic cat (when running) in the world,
they have very fast reaction times, they have an extra flap of skin between their legs that allows them to extend their legs wider to enable them to run faster,
they are typically silver spotted, but can be bronze spotted or smoke (with no spots)
they tend to not like sitting on peoples laps
their rear legs are disproprotionately longer than their front legs (almost like a kangaroo)
they make a chortling sound
they kneed their front paws together and do dance that makes them look like they are crapping.
Obviously, you may get an Egyptian Mau who has all or few of the above traits, however, those are the typcial breed characteristics.
Bengal. This one is a little interesting as when you think about it, Bengals arent really pedigree cats, as at some stage, each Bengal was mixed with Asian Leopard Cat and another domestic cat. Though I think many chose the Egyptian Mau, which is why some people mistake the Mau and Bengal for sometimes being the same cat. This "mixing" defies the meaning of pedigree, but thats how it all started and there was no other way.
Bengals:
are generally bigger than the Egyptian Mau
can have very similar colouring, though rossettes are common in their coat, which Mau's never have
they arent as quick as the Maus
their front legs are in proportion with the rest of their bodies
they are more likely to sit in someone's lap, especially when feeling sleepy
Those are the things I can think of, off the top of my head.
-
Its very easy to tell from a pedigree what F number a bengal is......most SBT's will have no reference to ALC in their 5 generation pedigree certs (which most breeders provide) however in an F1 you will see the parent with ALC abrev, the F2 with a grandparent ALC abrev etc. Most lines of bengals (even sbts can be traced back to their original alc lines which is fascinating :-)). Most can tell by looking that egs are not typical bengals but thats prob true of the very early gens e.g. f1s.
In terms of bengals and maus i agree to the novice there can be confusion between the 2 breeds. One of the key difference for me is quality and smoothness of pelt. In a good bengal you will have no ticking of the coat and the pelt will be like silk..... Ticking is very prominant in the egyptian mau coat and some bengals still carry this from the original matings (it is not a desired trait although accepted in very early gens). Additionally the head shape, muzzle etc is quite different. Sunama also makes a good point about the rosetting that is seen in bengals.....maus have small spots and again whilst some bengals do too what we are really looking for is nice dark arrowheads or rosetting in bengals. Clearly bengals can also come in marble which is another difference and a range of colours. All mine have much longer hind legs which again is a desired trait.
-
In terms of bengals and maus i agree to the novice there can be confusion between the 2 breeds. One of the key difference for me is quality and smoothness of pelt. In a good bengal you will have no ticking of the coat and the pelt will be like silk.....
Specifically what do you mean by "ticking"?
As an example, my Egyptain Mau's coat seems a lot more smoother and shiney. My Bengal on the other hand has a drier coat and isnt as smooth. It feels like dry hair.
-
Ticking is the "glitter" you see on some. It tends to when each strand of hair has different shade, usually coming up lighter to the tip of the strand. Abysinians are ticked for example.
-
Very interesting information, thank you. I see both traits in various forms in my Bengal. They are a very fasinating breed, I will have a look at the pedigree a bit more closely at some point. I would love to meet an F1 in the flesh just to see what a true bengal should look like. :Luv:
-
In terms of bengals and maus i agree to the novice there can be confusion between the 2 breeds. One of the key difference for me is quality and smoothness of pelt. In a good bengal you will have no ticking of the coat and the pelt will be like silk.....
Specifically what do you mean by "ticking"?
As an example, my Egyptain Mau's coat seems a lot more smoother and shiney. My Bengal on the other hand has a drier coat and isnt as smooth. It feels like dry hair.
Very surprised to hear that your bengal has a coat like 'dry hair'......my sbt bengals have very silky pelts as do my kittens. Some info from breed standards below.
Cat Fanciers Association Breed Standard - Egyptian Mau
COAT: hair is medium in length with a lustrous sheen. In the smoke color the hair is silky and fine in texture. In the silver and bronze colors, the hair is dense and resilient in texture and accommodates two or more bands of ticking separated by lighter bands
GCCF Breed Standard - Bengal
Short to medium in length, very dense, luxurious and unusually soft to the touch.
TICA Breed Standard - Bengal
Dense and luxurious, close-lying, unusually soft and silky to the touch.
Ticking (different bands of colour giving an overall wild appearance as in Abys, Egyptian Maus and indeed Early Gen bengals) shouldnt be confused with Glitter which is unique to bengals and caused by a clear hollow shaft of hair. Its not required by the breed standard but does enhance the exotic quality of the bengal.
Ticking is not a desired trait in the bengal breed.
-
Very interesting information, thank you. I see both traits in various forms in my Bengal. They are a very fasinating breed, I will have a look at the pedigree a bit more closely at some point. I would love to meet an F1 in the flesh just to see what a true bengal should look like. :Luv:
If you are ever up my way you are more than welcome to come meet all my bengals and of course my F1's :)
-
One of my silky bengal pelts :Luv:
(http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w196/bengalbabe_2007/P1010110.jpg)
-
One of my silky bengal pelts :Luv:
(http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w196/bengalbabe_2007/P1010110.jpg)
That is indeed a very smooth looking coat. My Egyptian Mau's coat is like that, but as I stated earlier, my Bengal has very dry hair. It doesnt bother me though.
-
If you are ever up my way you are more than welcome to come meet all my bengals and of course my F1's :)
[/quote]
Where abouts are you Linda? I am in Edinburgh. If I am ever anywhere near you, I will definately be in for a peek!
I have to say before I purchased Tia, I had only ever vagually heard about Bengals. I am amazed to hear all about the breed standards for both.
Not that I am biased or anything, but I have never met a cat with such a loving gentle personality/nature.
-
That is indeed a very smooth looking coat. My Egyptian Mau's coat is like that, but as I stated earlier, my Bengal has very dry hair. It doesnt bother me though.
[/quote]
Would love to see a piccy of your bengal sunama?
-
If you are ever up my way you are more than welcome to come meet all my bengals and of course my F1's :)
Where abouts are you Linda? I am in Edinburgh. If I am ever anywhere near you, I will definately be in for a peek!
I have to say before I purchased Tia, I had only ever vagually heard about Bengals. I am amazed to hear all about the breed standards for both.
Not that I am biased or anything, but I have never met a cat with such a loving gentle personality/nature.
[/quote]
About 45 mins from you LOL .... Im just outside Stirling :evillaugh:
-
Would love to see a piccy of your bengal sunama?
Its all in this thread:
http://www.purrsinourhearts.co.uk/index.php/topic,13672.120.html
-
About 45 mins from you LOL .... Im just outside Stirling :evillaugh:
[/quote]
OOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHH :wow:, got a hire car booked for a week from 9th.......watch this space :rofl:
-
No problem, just drop me a PM and we can arrange ;)
-
Its all in this thread:
http://www.purrsinourhearts.co.uk/index.php/topic,13672.120.html
[/quote]
Both cats are very very similar and gorgeous :Luv: :Luv:
-
I read an ad for negals and it used the word pelt and it made me cringe - makes me think of cruella de vil!
Thats one shiny kitty ;D do you use tre semme :rofl:
-
Thats one shiny kitty ;D do you use tre semme :rofl:
I was thinking along similar lines. Is some conditioning product being used?
-
Rainbow and Roxy are both fantastic examples of tri marbles and their coats are naturally that silky and shiny. I have yet to see a cat from their breeder who doesn't have a coat like that.
-
Never doubted, ad was on the telly :rofl:
-
Thats one shiny kitty ;D do you use tre semme :rofl:
I was thinking along similar lines. Is some conditioning product being used?
[/quote
The only grooming these girls receive is by my hand, no products i can assure you!
Thank you Lottie xxx