Good news re fur trade

[Tan]

A few more threads have been moderated. While i agree any awful cruelty anywhere including England mustn't be hidden from public sight, we need to consider the good people form all over the world who adore animals and human life.  Please becareful with your posts. Thanks.

[Christine (Blip)]

I have asked for people to desist from racism and I have moderated one post.  Would you PM me, CC, and let me know which comment I may have missed?  Thanks.

[ccmacey]

I notice 1 person on here has made racial coments, and this is not the first, why has nothing been done as it isnt right!

[Mark]

I found this quote the other day and posted on another thread and it is so true



"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing". Edmund Burke

[Christine (Blip)]

I know I may be criticised for this, but it along the lines of sadistic concentration camps.

In my opinion, Mark, you are right - it is when we lose empathy for others, human or animal, that atrocities happen.

[Mark]

I think we need to see them to prove it really happens. When I saw the cats in the cages I tried to imagine if it were mine. When I think that they are crammed in cages, fed a bowl of rice and some "animal feed" (god knows whats in that - if people are going to kill & eat them, I hope its slow-acting poison) and to suffer the fate. I keep saying it but the video of the cat in the cage where one cat was licking another to reassure it is probably more upsetting than the gruesome pictures. I think this has affected me more than anything. I know I may be criticised for this, but it along the lines of sadistic concentration camps. I want to find out more and get actively involved. i want to find out if all the TV stations in the world have this footage so the whole world knows whats going on there.

[CurlyCatz]

those photos were indescribable mark 

I just cant help myself from looking at such things, its like unless i do it doesn't sink in that such barbaric atrocities happen 

[Tan]

I can understand the pain here and i just couldn't face seeing your links Mark or barely able to read all the posts about whats in them. I have nightmares still from being a memeber of Animal aid and had to leave from being in a state of always crying.  But as others have been saying we can't tar a whole countries people with the same cruel brush. I am half German and sadly the word "German" is still seen alot in England as bad race. It is the 1st thing i get whenever i meantion my fathers home country. I'ts the same for every single country in the world, every one has crulty weather human or animal form but thank god there is also good trying to fight the bad too.

What happens when we have a thread of cruelty like this one is we all are hurt and absolutely shocked by what is happening to the animals and anger is a natural state we express against the people who are committing it. If this thread was about people in another country the reactions would be no different. It's the evil people committing the crime no matter where they are that needs to be targeted in a way we might be able to help stop it.

[Sam (Fussy_Furball)]

Lyn-Su please accept my apologies if I anyway made you think I regard all chinese as cat-killers ... I totally agree with not tarring everyone with the same brush.  One of the ladies I work with is chinese she is the pround mummy of two beautiful kitties, a mad little staffy who thinks she's a cat, and she is also a vegitarian.

[Mark]

Here is some positive news. An article from earlier this year where a chinese animal rights movement saved 400 cats from a market
http://www.guardian.co.uk/china/story/0,,2011569,00.html

Here is not good news - very graphic pictures. I know some people don't want to see this but people need to realise what is happening. The article said that due a lot of people being affluent, eating cat meat is on the increase. It needs to be stopped.

http://sirius.2kat.net/cats.html

[Kittybabe (Ruth)]

Agreed Christine. We've moderated some threads before for some comments which are taken out of context and could hurt others please lets keep this friendly to each other (we do after all come to Purrs as our home away from home) and avoid sweeping and generalising comments.

China is targetted yes, but so should many other countries be who devastate the animal kingdom with acts of cruelty.

[Dawn (DiddyDawn)]

I agree with Lynn....there is good and bad in every culture and we can't tar everyone with the same brush.  The fur trade is absolutely sickening and the peeps who do this want stringing up by their genitalia but we also have some cruel   in our country, for eg kids who throw cats off balconies, kids throwing cats onto the motorway,   hanging someones pet dog and then setting fire to it.........does that make us all "evil   ", I think not.   Sadly though, until the fur trade stops and cats are seen for what they are, a living, feeling being, the chinese will continue to be targeted.

[Christine (Blip)]

No-one is more appalled than I am by the barbaric treatment afforded to animals in China - and elsewhere - but Lyn Su is right to protest that it is wrong to assume all people of similar ethnic backgrounds have the same views, on this or any other matter.

We must continue to debate this dreadful, dreadful treatment of sentient beings, but please let us avoid racism and prejudice.  Thanks guys.

[Mark]

We know exactly what you meant Lynn 

[CurlyCatz]

i have just re read posts and realised a fundamental spelling mistake i made in my own .. i do hope you realised my mistake which i will now modify but should have read as

I really think we should  SHOULDN'T tar all with the same brush, china is a massive place.

[CurlyCatz]

Lyn Su please dont leave the forum, if you read all the posts you will see that atleast some of us have said that ALL are not the same.  The sweeping generalisations upset me aswell but unfortunately in life some people really do believe such to be true. However i dont think its an example of how we all feel and i'd be very upset to see you go, esp on the grounds of racism.

Personally you can do far more good by staying and educating people to allow them to have much more balanced opinions.
 
 

[Lyn-Su]

The question on the ' british born or long time residents

They have the same mentality

I can certainly say they do not. I am half chinese and I'm really starting to consider leaving this forum as this is the second time all ethnically Chinese people have been labelled cat eaters of pet haters. I never thought that I could experience such small mindedness and racism on a place I did up until recently consider a great place to talk about cats.

For the record - I have never eaten cat - nor know anyone who has - I have also never worn fur of any kind!

[Mark]

I think more chinese people would against than for this kind of thing. They said on the video that a lot of the cats were wearing collars so were obviously pets stolen from regular chinese people. This is probably a very isolated situation and most people in China would be horrified by it - BUT - as there are no laws against it, the authorities need to have pressure put on them to get laws in place to stop it AND punish the offenders - we know China is very good at punishment.

[CurlyCatz]

in defense of a chinese family who have lived here since i was a small child (when warrens parents ran the place) Although i dont really know them personally i know they are decent and dont have the "same mentality", they are lovely peeps.

I really think we shouldn't tar all with the same brush, china is a massive place.

CC they probably have to pay money when the girls get married to the "in laws" family or something.  But also in china its illegal to have more than one child i think (or is it two)  and in some areas atleast they are very strict on that law.

[MBll]

The question on the ' british born or long time residents

Observation deleted by Moderator

[Mark]

mark also mentioned not going to chinese restaurants, my only questions on that is would it be fair to the british born or long time residents who run chinese food shops..they probably get their supplys from the same places as all the other multi nationality restaurants (well i would have thought ?)

Our local ethnic supply shop is called "Thais are us" 

[ccmacey]

Yes I think I may have seen that too Mags, whats wrong with girls. 

There is a petition on here about the tigers and the cruelty going on, its in the Animal petitions section please sign it. 

[MBll]

Sometime ago there was a documentary on chinas orphans & while filiming  in 1 of the state homes the film crew stumbled on a baby girl left on her own in a cold dark room to die ...just cos she was female, they hold no regard for girls. the film drew was shocked & when they went back next day she was gone & the folk diened all knowledge of her.


Recently they was another documentary on the trade of endangered animals & on the illeagal breeding &  killing of tigers for the pelt, there was a film shown taken by a tourist & quite clearly showning   a tipper truck driven in to the tigers enclose & the truck was tipped up & a live cow was tipped out & it fell on its belly & got  up & you could hear it screeming as it tried to run away from the tigers

[Mark]

Its a really difficult one.

As for not being fair to british born or long term residents, I came to the conclusion a long time ago after dealing with "cowboys" and dishonest traders that I don't owe anyone a living. I will be extra careful from now on. My next purchase - today probably will be a printer so I will have to make sure it isn't made in China. I will have to change brands when I upgrade my Hi-fi as I always buy NAD separates but they are "designed in the UK, assembled in China"

[CurlyCatz]

mark also mentioned not going to chinese restaurants, my only questions on that is would it be fair to the british born or long time residents who run chinese food shops..they probably get their supplys from the same places as all the other multi nationality restaurants (well i would have thought ?)

i totally agree with everything else, only yesterday i had a second hand (nearly new) pair of roller boots delivered and see the label says "made in china"    I will be checking labels (esp clothing) more closely from now on.

[Beanie]

Just caught up with this thread.

Great news except the derral until 2009. I simply don't understand that.

Somebody else made the comparison about their apparant care for Pandas. The Chinese know that the animal most associated with them is the panda and the world links the two together. It is also a tourist money spinner which masks the vile and barbaric fur trade.

I will not knowlingly purchase any Chinese goods or visit Chinese restaurants. I wouldn't have given them the Olympics but now it is going ahead, hopefully some good can come out of it by highlighting the real nature of the Chinese where human life has little value and animal life even less. Better late than never I guess but too many animals wills suffer horrific deaths before the ban is imposed.

What can we do? Express our horror, yes. But PLEASE spread the word and make friends, relatives and work colleagues fully aware. I will watch the video later but have seen similar. I think it is important to watch this stuff, however grotesque and unpallatable, so that you redouble your efforts. Too many animal lovers bury their heads in the sand rather than pass on the word.

Sometimes people ask you What type of animal would you like to be if you come back to earth?My answer is that I wouldn't. I'd like to come back as a deadly virus and selectively wipe out people who are systematically wiping out the animal kingdom and destroying nature.

Keep this in the public eye.

[Millys Mum]

My mum said that she saw a programme - I don't know which country it was.  They beat the dogs while they are alive "to make the meat more tender" 

The cat/dog meat trade is as bad as the fur trade   i saw something about duck eggs that they incubate and when about to hatch they par boil them and eat it 

In this country im told that pigs are tumbled in big turny things to remove the bristles 

[ccmacey]

I dont get these sorts of people! Do they see everything alive as some sort of food source? Surely they must have cow's, chickens etc. Why eat something we regard as pets?

[Mark]

My mum said that she saw a programme - I don't know which country it was.  They beat the dogs while they are alive "to make the meat more tender" 

[MBll]

This happens on other animals aswell........
foxes....racoons...chinchillas......monkeys.....otters......mink....stoats.....rabbits.....the list goes on & on ....what about them?


The only ones that should wear fur are the animals

[Sam (Fussy_Furball)]

The best way to get China to stop these autorocities (to humans and animals) is to take the bloody Olympics away from them!  I do not understand how  they can be expected to change their ways when the rest of the world will be throwing hundreds of thousands (probably millions) of $ at them in sponsorship etc to host the games.

I am pleased they are banning pet fur but like has already been said what about the other poor animals ... raccoons, mink, foxes, wolves, beavers, tigers, etc etc etc etc they will also suffer horrid barbaric and cruel deaths.  I haven't watched any of the videos that Mark linked to but I have in the past watched the videos on the PETA website .... watching Chinese trappers skinning raccoons alive after partially stunning them with home made electrocution equipment made me physically sick ... the images will stay with me for as long as I live.  Although I find the images harrowing I think everyone should see them in order to understand just what really goes on.

I honestly believe there are so many people who genuinely have no idea of what really goes on.  Although they themselves would never wear fur they still think that animals used in the fur trade are killed humanely and do not suffer.  If only they knew the truth.

RIP all you poor little souls who have suffered at the hands of humans ... on behalf of my species I apologise to you all 

[Mark]

I realised tonight I need to be more vigilant with my purchases.

When I got home, I realised I had a typhoon egg pan - made in china 
a garden chair - made in china 

I will be on my guard in future

[catzluva71]

Good news indeed, but like everyone has said why wait so long?
And who will there be to make sure that the torture is not carrying on "undercover"?

Perhaps now they will do something to help Chinas other animals, like the poor bears that are made to ride bikes and dance in the name of "entertainment".  There was an article about this in a newspaper a little while back, and I happened to say to a work colleague that I hated that   When I told him about the fur trade etc, all he could say was "oh".

Now going to find my baby to give him a cuddle and grieve for all those poor animals.

[Mark]

If you want to test if a fibre is manmade or fur just hold some in a lighter. Acrylics will melt where as fur will smoke and smell horrid.

I remember reading that somewhere. They say unless you are 100% sure something is synthetic, don't buy it in the 1st placw. There is apparently a company called Nauticalia in the UK that is selling toy cats which are made from real cat fur 

I have been thinking so much about this  and still can't understand what makes sane people harden enough to do his kind of thing. They should be executed for it.

[ccmacey]

Yes it was Mark 

Although they say the dog was "wagging" its tail, you could see it was more out of fear!

Also showed cats in cages and  trying to hoop them with some sort of wire lasso. Because one cat wouldn't move they were poking it in the head with a metal bar!!!!!!!!!!

The cats were sort of "cuddling" each other out of fear!!! 

Please find the petition as something needs to be done!

[Millys Mum]

I wont watch your links Mark as i have probably already seen some of them, the dog one sounds familiar. Its f :censored:d up and when i get a terminal disease i wouldnt mind going for a trip with a gun or 3.

If you want to test if a fibre is manmade or fur just hold some in a lighter. Acrylics will melt where as fur will smoke and smell horrid.

[Mark]

I didn't see the news. Was it the same video with the dog being chained to the fence wagging its tail? - Thats what makes it even more heartbreaking that the dog trusted the man completely yet little did he know, he was going to be skinned alive. 

For man, read scum who should be skinned alive themselves.

I will look for other petitions as unchained, BUAV etc will probably have more going and its better everyone signs the same one rhather than loads of different ones going. I expect over the next few days we will see the campaigners views on the ruling. Again another example of polititians hiding behind red tape. The should have said the ban was straight away - it was too late already.

[ccmacey]

Anyone on here know how to start a petition for this?

I nearly watched the video but have not got the stomach for it, what I seen on the news last night brought me to tears, and then the anger followed!!!!!!!!!!

[Mark]

9 years behind America 

That angry enough Lynn?

Well a petition needs to be started to boycott all Chinese goods until 2009 then.

[CurlyCatz]

thats just bloody rediculous..why indeed cant they just start as of...    <<<< that doesnt really pinpoint the correct emotion really --- tan we need angrier smileys !