Topic: I need your feedback please (Read 11840 times)

Den · « **Reply #72 on:** November 10, 2010, 20:27:39 PM »

It is something to do with the change in stomach acidity when feeding kibble and raw. Someone did explain it to me years ago.

It is also due to raw digesting at a faster rate than kibble. Feeding raw with kibble slows the digestion of raw down, increasing the length of time it is in the digestive system thus increasing the chances of bacteria multiplying and causing a problem.

Fire Fox · « **Reply #71 on:** November 10, 2010, 20:14:16 PM »

Quote from: Den on November 10, 2010, 12:31:05 PM

When feeding raw and dry you need to feed them at different times of the day ... never at the same time. Raw and dry take different times to digest and the kibble interferes with the digestion of the raw.

I keep reading that, but there is never any evidence provided. I am overly suspicious as the whole food combining concept in humans has been debunked.

A macronutrient is a macronutrient, mammaliam anatomy doesn't distinguish between raw and cooked amino acids AFAIK. Do you know what the scientific basis of that is, Den?

Cooper & Peanut · « **Reply #70 on:** November 10, 2010, 12:38:12 PM »

Quote from: Den on November 10, 2010, 12:31:05 PM

When feeding raw and dry you need to feed them at different times of the day ... never at the same time. Raw and dry take different times to digest and the kibble interferes with the digestion of the raw.

Okey dokey! Thanks for the advice! Will remember that

Den · « **Reply #69 on:** November 10, 2010, 12:31:05 PM »

When feeding raw and dry you need to feed them at different times of the day ... never at the same time. Raw and dry take different times to digest and the kibble interferes with the digestion of the raw.

Cooper & Peanut · « **Reply #68 on:** November 10, 2010, 12:01:43 PM »

Well.....I've now got my puds eating Purina One dry. They absolutely love it! Thing is, they now aren't fussed about eating the Whiskas, which is a good thing because its crap food but I still want them to eat something wet along with the dry. They are both drinking well, so that's something I suppose.

I'm gonna try them on raw along side the dry....but feed them from my hand rather than dumping lumps in their bowl, cuz when I've done that before, they weren't interested but they have taken bits from my hand.

Lil_Scruff · « **Reply #67 on:** October 28, 2010, 17:19:35 PM »

Two of mine have been known to have sensitive tums but I've recently been feeding them on the Whiskers poultry in jelly selection box and it's resulted in lovely firm poos!

Before this they were on Felix as Good as It Looks with mixed results. Although good quality I think that the beef and salmon falvours which come in the boxes are a bit strong for sensitive tums.

They also have a little good quality dry - Royal Canin or sometimes James Wellbeloved.

Cooper & Peanut · « **Reply #66 on:** October 28, 2010, 15:09:40 PM »

Poops have returned to normal

Peanut has gained weight and is now 3kg!

Fire Fox · « **Reply #65 on:** October 26, 2010, 18:05:51 PM »

If they have only had a very few Applaws biscuits by the time the

happened, it's less likely new food caused the problem. As I said earlier he may have an imbalance in the gut flora, so it might be worth a short course of probiotics (LactoB etc.) along with Whiskas and then introduce new foods? It took a few attempts with Noah on various combinations before I was confident what was setting him off. You could try JWB and RC at some point, but both contain a high percentage of grains - I'd confirm it isn't the same ones that are in the Omega.

Kay and Penny · « **Reply #64 on:** October 26, 2010, 14:03:09 PM »

Trigger loves the souffle with egg Gourmet food, and always does a runny poo after eating it - but it's just the one - so I restrict him to one of the tins a week

I don't see one runny poo, or one being sick, as anything to worry about if there is no repeat performance - it's just the body's natural way of eliminating something it didn't much care for

MrsR · « **Reply #63 on:** October 26, 2010, 13:58:09 PM »

When I see you you can have some JWB and RC food to try them on later.

Cooper & Peanut · « **Reply #62 on:** October 26, 2010, 13:50:09 PM »

Okay, will do. I gave them literally only a few of the applaws to try and they woofed 'em down.

I tried the P@H pouch this morning and neither of them even went near it.

You're right, I defo need to stick to Whiskas until I know that both poops are solid

I know they like it so at least they are not gonna be walking around in starvation mode

The omega is still not being offered, and I won't offer them anymore applaws either, see what happens

It's all a bit trial and error with me I'm afraid!

Fire Fox · « **Reply #61 on:** October 26, 2010, 13:32:30 PM »

Have you introduced two new foods simultaneously or am I reading that wrong? I would stick with the Whiskas only until you have firm poops again, then just introduce a tiny amount of one new food and increase slowly. To digest food mammals use a combination of stomach acid and enzymes, the acid is unlikely be an issue - cats have a more acidic stomach than ours. There are different enzymes needed to digest protein, fats and carbohydrates and these take time to manufacture. A full elimination diet is one food at a time, that doesn't mean a product with ingredients, it can mean just one thing for days on end (eg. potatoes!).

Mark · « **Reply #60 on:** October 25, 2010, 18:29:39 PM »

Personally, I wouldn't withhold food due to one runny poo. If it continued, I would feed bland food for 24hrs. Any new food that is suddenly introduced can upset them - especially something so rich.

Cooper & Peanut · « **Reply #59 on:** October 25, 2010, 17:44:14 PM »

What do they say about "speaking too soon"?!

Cooper has just done a diarrhea type poop

......sigh

Excuse my ignorance, but do you treat cats like you would a human and not feed them for so many hours, if they have extremely runny poop???

Mark · « **Reply #58 on:** October 25, 2010, 16:15:04 PM »

I just double checked Encore and it is 1.6% - the highest I have ever seen. To give you an idea, most adult foods are around 1 - 1.2%, senior foods 0.6 - 0.7% and renal around 0.3% - as you say, if cats are given other foods, it is probably fine.

ANyway, I just found this really good reference to check analysis of lots of different foods

http://www.petforums.co.uk/cat-health-nutrition/116753-z-dry-food-cats.html

Obviously Applaws is the same.

It also says this "General info: A great grain-free, high meat content food that is holding its own with grainy dry foods price-wise. However, it is currently plagued by controversy and law suits re its ingredients."

Cooper & Peanut · « **Reply #57 on:** October 25, 2010, 16:05:53 PM »

ummmmmm......I'm now nervous of using it. Possum died of renal failure so the last thing I want to do is put a death sentence on my current puds....

Thanks for the tip off re the cheaper version - was unaware of that

Maybe I will only offer it in small quantities then....until I can find something else they like that is better for them..

Mark · « **Reply #56 on:** October 25, 2010, 15:56:48 PM »

Did you know you can get Applaws, both wet & dry in Sainsbury's under a different name? - it is called Encore and is cheaper

http://www.mysupermarket.co.uk/sainsburys-price-comparison/Cat_Food/Encore_Chicken_Dry_Complete_800g.html

I looked on PAH site but they don't show the dry.

I tried it once but stopped as I thought the phosphorus content was too high for senior cats - probably due to the high meat content

Not to scare, but I'm sure some on here remember last year where someone blamed it for making their cat/s ill. I remember it was going to court and they had to take the accusations offline. I don't remember hearing any more though.

Cooper & Peanut · « **Reply #55 on:** October 25, 2010, 15:43:05 PM »

Okay....so I took away the omega and I haven't noticed any sloppy stools in the last couple of days...

I went to PAH today and bought some Applaws 80% chicken dry and some PAH adult complete pouches for them to try.

Well, they absolutely LOVE the applaws dry!

Peanut especially....which really pleases me cuz it takes a lot to get her excited about food

I will try the pouches tonight...

I'm like a kid in a toy shop when it comes to choosing and buying food for them

Cooper & Peanut · « **Reply #54 on:** October 23, 2010, 13:35:40 PM »

Quote from: Fire Fox on October 23, 2010, 13:32:26 PM

Let us know how it goes!

Will do!

Fire Fox · « **Reply #53 on:** October 23, 2010, 13:32:26 PM »

Let us know how it goes!

Honeysuckle · « **Reply #52 on:** October 23, 2010, 12:53:26 PM »

My indoor cat has:

1) Breakfast: Applaws Chicken & Ostrich Sachet from local pet shop
2) Second Breakfast (she's like a hobbit): Teaspoon of Dried Royal Cannin for Young Felines from my vet
3) Lunch - Whiskas Fish Stick with Omega 3 cut up into bits and thrown so she can chase - she loves this game and will sometimes bring me the packet for me to open! - pet shop
4) Dinner - about 75 grams raw chicken breast cut up into big cubes. (M&S or Waitrose)

My Outdoor cat has:

1) Breakfast: Sachet of Hi Life Poultry Collection or Bozita (Rabbit or Turkey) with few cubes of cooked chicken, turkey or ham mixed in. (Cat food from Pet Store and cooked chicken from M&S or Waitrose)
2) If he's around during the day a few Dried Royal Cannin or fish stick as a treat.
3) Dinner: Same as breakfast but with bigger proportion of cooked chicken or turkey.

Cooper & Peanut · « **Reply #51 on:** October 23, 2010, 12:36:38 PM »

It's not full on runs, but too loose for my liking

Peanut is skinny (last weigh in was 2.7kg) and so we have been a bit naughty and given her more treats than Cooper in a hope to fatten her up a bit! She is very funny at meal times. If Coops likes what he's given, he'll happily eat his and then move on to hers! If I move hers out the way, she then won't eat at all!

I currently have the meat varieties of Whiskas (but also keep the odd sachet of Feline Fayre or Hi Life which have been in both fish and meat)

I'll remove the omega then, and see what happens... Really appreciate the advice Fire Fox!

Fire Fox · « **Reply #50 on:** October 23, 2010, 12:25:16 PM »

If people don't want to talk about cat poo I am sure they will read another thread!

The reason I ask about previous toilet habits is that long term diarrhoea could have reduced the population of beneficial bacteria, plus carbs feed the bad guys.

Rather than trying to work out who is eating what and who is pooping what, I'd be inclined to eliminate the Purina Omega for a few days. Leave them on the Whiskas: if you have non-fishy Whiskas so much the better. It could be the treats, but they are usually high in cereals so just removing those won't help your detective work: I presume Peanut is not getting as many treats as Cooper is getting dry food, so she still might have problems with cereals.

The issue is more likely to be difficulty digesting than a full on allergy, so small amounts of carbs won't necessarily result in

in the tray. If the Purina Omega is the culprit then you might use it up as treats or by diluting with a larger amount of a high meat content dry food. Elimination diets are what is used in human medicine, at present you way too many different ingredients going into them to be confident of isolating the cause.

Cooper & Peanut · « **Reply #49 on:** October 23, 2010, 10:45:21 AM »

I have no idea what their toilet habits were before we had them. The RSPCA were quite vague... They were being fed the dry (which I put down) but the young girl who was looking after them said they weren't keen on it but she occasionally fed them meat and they preferred that..

I noticed Cooper was eating the Omega biscuits when there was nothing else on offer (or more to the point, when I had down the feline fayre or Hi Life

) He's slowed down on the dry since going back on Whiskas.

I think its going to be a very slow painful process of elimination isn't it?!

I need to try and catch them both in the act of pooing and if it's Cooper that's producing the slop, then it might suggest its the cereals in the dry that's causing it, as Peanut never touches them. It could be the treats! I will admit that we can get carried away with offering them Temptations/Dentabits/Dreamies etc.. so it could be that!

Oh my days.....I need a flipping degree to get my head around all this nutrition lark! Apologies for everyone having to read my drivel - it must be soooooooooo boring to keep reading the same problems

Fire Fox · « **Reply #48 on:** October 23, 2010, 09:51:59 AM »

Quote from: KookyPoss (Hayley) on October 23, 2010, 08:39:29 AM

thanks fire fox

Well I think the decision has been made for me. As much as they seem to adore Whiskas, its causing one of them to produce very sloppy plop

I really find this stressful cuz I want them to eat well and enjoy their food but when I try them on better quality stuff, they walk away - hungry!

I forget how lucky I am that Noah will eat almost anything animal-related! Are you sure it is the Whiskas that is causing the problems in the litter tray - you said one is still eating the dry? For Noah it is definitely cereals and too much fish (especially tuna

). Meat-based cat food produces acceptable poop and raw produces small smell-free offerings!

Has this been going on since before you adopted them? If so probiotics - e.g. LactoB - may be beneficial.

Janeyk · « **Reply #47 on:** October 23, 2010, 09:20:27 AM »

Quote from: KookyPoss (Hayley) on October 23, 2010, 09:18:27 AM

Who makes Classic Janey? Where's it from?

Butchers and most supermarkets sell it and pet shops

Cooper & Peanut · « **Reply #46 on:** October 23, 2010, 09:18:27 AM »

Who makes Classic Janey? Where's it from?

Janeyk · « **Reply #45 on:** October 23, 2010, 08:54:33 AM »

I think that a variatin of foods is good. If they enjoy Whiskas I'd just give it occasionally. Pepper can't eat Feline Fayre it seems to make him sick. I've always found Classic good for funny tums.

Cooper & Peanut · « **Reply #44 on:** October 23, 2010, 08:39:29 AM »

thanks fire fox

Well I think the decision has been made for me. As much as they seem to adore Whiskas, its causing one of them to produce very sloppy plop

I really find this stressful cuz I want them to eat well and enjoy their food but when I try them on better quality stuff, they walk away - hungry!

Fire Fox · « **Reply #43 on:** October 23, 2010, 02:12:45 AM »

Pets at Home Purely in the 156g tins are back on the five for £2 offer

were retailing last week for 47p last week. These are complete unlike the blue Feline Fayre which is the closest brand as both contains large chucks of pure fish.

Fire Fox · « **Reply #42 on:** October 19, 2010, 21:41:17 PM »

Don't beat yourself up for buying the dry that the RSPCA recommended, it could have been a far more stressful introduction if they'd refused to eat or had diarrhoea due to the change of diet and location.

You've all the time in the world to work on improving their diet, it's long term poor nutrition that has a negative effect on health. There are worse diets than Whiskas wet - it contains animal protein, taurine, vitamins and minerals.

If you think Cooper and Peanut are going to be fussy about switching dry, maybe e-mail various companies for samples; some are very generous and very quick to post out. I mixed several samples into our first bag of Orijen to use them up without giving Noah carb overload!

Cooper & Peanut · « **Reply #41 on:** October 19, 2010, 21:13:03 PM »

I actually tried mixing it with the Whiskas but they still wouldn't touch it

maybe I should try again but change the ratio

Feline Costumier · « **Reply #40 on:** October 19, 2010, 20:29:43 PM »

When Little Miss first moved in she flatly refused to eat any dry food and for budgetry reasons I really wanted to try and get her enjoying them. My tactic was to mix a few with the wet, gradually increasing the ratio and now she will happily eat a meal of dry only.

You could try a similar tactic with the wet, perhaps mixing a bit of the good stuff with the rubbish stuff and gradually alter the ratios. It could just be that their palette isn't used tot he higher quality. Again, Little Miss has taken a little convincing on some of the better quality stuff, at first she would only eat Sheba!

Cooper & Peanut · « **Reply #39 on:** October 19, 2010, 18:56:03 PM »

Well....Cooper and Peanut are flatly refusing to eat both Hi Life 60% meat/fish and the Feline Fayre

However when I put bloomin Whiskas down, they gobble it up like no tomorrow!!

Cooper has even started eating the dry biscuits that I put down (which I cant wait to get rid of, cuz it contains cereals). I really wish I hadn't let the RSPCA pressure me into buying the stuff....surely they should know its not good for cats!

The saga continues........

Desley (booktigger) · « **Reply #38 on:** October 18, 2010, 08:17:06 AM »

Gill, have you tried James Wellbeloved Fish Flavour - you can normally buy it in small 225g bags, or they will send you samples. I can't remember how small the fish biscuits are.

Fire Fox · « **Reply #37 on:** October 18, 2010, 00:12:52 AM »

Quote from: KookyPoss (Hayley) on October 16, 2010, 21:49:02 PM

We went to Morrisons today and I got some Feline Fayre pouches and some Hi Life pouches, which were all 60% meat/fish. They were about 44p per pouch. They didn't have tinned versions or boxes of pouches.

Where are you getting them from for less than that????

I've just given them some of the Hi Life and it seemed to go down fairly well.....

I shall have to see what happens

Feline Fayre multipacks (8 fishy pouches) are frequently on offer for £1+ in B&M and Home Bargains: the 400g tins are sometimes 29p in the same stores.

All variants come on offer at Asda every so often - usually 25p for a single pouch, 50p for a 400g tin or £1 for a multipack. According to Feline Fayre themselves, NISA and Savers are also stockists of the large tins but I can't tell you the prices.

I only buy the blue packs (complementary) which I feed alongside Bozita or Orijen (both complete). I don't buy the black packs of FF as Bozita is cheaper for a comparable meat content and my furry dustbin is happy to sample whatever I serve!

I wish I knew exactly what was missing from the blue packs that they are not complete, because according to FF website:
"In addition, our recipes have been enriched with taurine to help maintain & support proper visual & cardiac function. Our products do not contain any artificial colours, flavours or preservatives."

HiLife is intermittently found in Wilkinsons, B&M or Home Bargains for 29p or 39p per pouch: Mark may be able to tell you where stocks HiLife tins. IMO Morrisons can't be beaten for quality fresh meat and fish (including cheap offal

) but prices are high for brand name stuff including pet food.

Desley (booktigger) · « **Reply #36 on:** October 17, 2010, 11:30:12 AM »

Just be careful when you are feeding FEline Fayre and HiLife as not all of it is complete, it is fine as long as you are feeding something else that day, but it shouldnt be the basis of their diet. The same goes for pet mince, it isn't a complete food, so cant' be fed on its own.

i personally can't feed my cats what I would like to feed them, which would be purely high meat content foods, as Molly's tum cant' tolerate it anymore, Zi is just plain picky with wet and I have to be careful what Buster eats, he can't tolerate high meat content dry, not risked him on wet. Mine are all currently getting Classic for wet (with some renal for Zi when she will eat it), Zi has renal dry (as she prefers dry to wet), Molly and Buster dont get any dry unless they pinch it, but both get chicken every day instead.

Cooper & Peanut · « **Reply #35 on:** October 16, 2010, 22:12:37 PM »

Oh fab, according to the store finder, there's one just up the road from me and I never realised what it was!

I shall check it out - fanks very much!

Feline Costumier · « **Reply #34 on:** October 16, 2010, 22:08:37 PM »

http://www.bmstores.co.uk/

Cooper & Peanut · « **Reply #33 on:** October 16, 2010, 22:01:41 PM »

B&M????

Author Topic: I need your feedback please (Read 11840 times)