Purrs In Our Hearts - Cat Forum UK
Cat General => General Cat Chat => Topic started by: Susanne (urbantigers) on May 13, 2007, 12:56:05 PM
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>:( >:(
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-23396060-details/Pet+cat+murdered+by+the+RSPCA/article.do
If the facts in the report are correct, 100% inexcusable.
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My goodness this is what we already know about and they have so many excuses............................well he has only been doing the job for 10yrs and cant recognize a cat thats fit and healthy, leaves it in a van for two hours and then sneakily puts it too sleep out of sight when he remembers, and now he is going to be retrained!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
he should be out of a job, he should not be working with animals, how many other animals has he killed?
Why are these totally unqualified medical experts allowed to put an animal to sleep without a vet being involved..............there is no excuse.
What would you say if it was your cat...........................sign the Petition, lets have this organization investigated cos this is only one of so many healthy and innocent animals to die at the hands of the RSPCA........they do not deserve Protection in their name and as for Royal............................!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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God almighty. This beggars belief.
Was thinking of asking an RSPCA inspector to intervene if my neighbour doesn't get back to me about taking her cat to the vet (see separate thread re Neighbours cat probs) but how can I trust them if this sort of thing can happen with an Inspector with 10 years experience? Thank god Thomas doesn't go wandering about outside our garden.....
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If this is indeed the case, then that's unconscionable.
One of my friends fosters oldies for CP, but she doesn't let them out unsupervised purely for that reason, as she's worried the neighbours would lodge complaints about the cats' condition and therefore cause problems.
She has two 16 year olds, a 19 year old and a 23 year old and all three are much loved and with every whim pandered to. Yes they are old and yes they are frail, but they are pretty good for their age. But for safety's sake, they're all collared, tagged and chipped.
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I saw this in my paper this morning, the people involved are thinking of suing the RSPCA and good luck to them I say. Poor Mork, there is a photo of him in the paper and he looked so sweet. The excuse that he was trying to do his best for the cat defies belief, he appears to have made no attempt to get it to a vet or find an owner/check for a microchip or anything. He drove Mork around for 2 hours then put him to sleep in front of his own house apparently. The facts seem to be undisputed in this case since the RSPCA have "disciplined" the inspector, admitted he followed none of the correct procedures and they have apologised to the family. Further words fail me I'm afraid :censored:
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That is absolutely unbelievable. Not only did he only give it a couple of hours which isn't long enough to check for an owner, but he euthanased on his belief the cat was incredibly old and suffering - why not get a vet to confirm that? Even if the cat did have an illness (which isn't mentioned), it doesn't mean that it needs to be euthanased.
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If the facts in the report are correct, 100% inexcusable.
I agree 100%, I also think that unless an animal is in obvious distress only a vet should decide the final outcome. Although very sad this is a prime example of why all pets need to be micro chipped.
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Was thinking of asking an RSPCA inspector to intervene if my neighbour doesn't get back to me about taking her cat to the vet
When there is a known owner, I think hope there would be a more positive outcome.
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One of my friends fosters oldies for CP, but she doesn't let them out unsupervised purely for that reason,
CP fosterer's should never let cats out anyway, unless of course in a completely cat safe garden. Also all CP cats should now be chipped (which tthe cats you speak about are) . CP HQ have offered free chip training to every CP Branch in the country. CP do not advocate the use of collars.
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If he really thought the cat was suffering why did he leave it in the van for 2 and half hours. I also wonder what makes inspectors allowed to PTS animals.
Ela, if he didnt make an effort to knock on a few doors and find the owner he probably wouldnt have scanned for a chip anyway.
Aren't you supposed to hold a stray for 7 days or its considered theft or something?
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sitting here in tears, I just dont understand this so called charity, everytime i hear case like this it makes me more and more angry. their ethics are none exsistent, their staff incompentent and the whole organisation is a farce. the sooner there is an investigation into them the better
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Aren't you supposed to hold a stray for 7 days or its considered theft or something?
We keep cats (unless suffering and untreatable) for 14 days before we would try to re-home.
Ela, if he didnt make an effort to knock on a few doors and find the owner he probably wouldnt have scanned for a chip anyway.
Although I have not much admiration for the charity, I do think he would have scanned the cat.
If he really thought the cat was suffering why did he leave it in the van for 2 and half hours.
Good point, anyone with an ounce of compassion would have gone to a vet immediately. if they though a cat was ill.
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HE Should have a lethal injection!!! >:(
The :censored: RSPCA have a lot to answer for!!
Isn't it bad enough there are scumbags hurting and killing animals, yet a representative of a CHARITY that is supposed to PREVENT cruelty is indescriminately killing animals.
Well done to "The Standard" for telling it like it is. "Pet cat murdered by the RSPCA"
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>:( OMG Thats awful >:( >:( >:(
it is very rare for that to happen though surely ????
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t is very rare for that to happen though surely ????
No comment. By my reply I am sure you know the answer. In any case even once is once too many and inexcusable.
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Rare or not, once is one too many. This man should be sacked and prosecuted.
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"In this instance, an RSPCA animal collection officer tried to do the right thing but made a tragic mistake.
"We would point out that the ACO had the best intentions at heart when dealing with Morky. He believed the cat to be stray, extremely old, ill and suffering.
"As a result he took the decision to euthanase the cat as soon as possible to put an end to the suffering he believed it to be experiencing."
:censored: :censored: :censored: Hello, how do they work this out????????
Absolutely disgusting :mad2: He should at the very least be suspended without pay whilst they investigate this case and then get the a*** whooping he deserves :censored:
If he assumed the animal to be a stray and ill, he should have been taken to a vets, he should have had the treatment he needed to make him comfortable and enquiries made to see if he had an owner..........there is absolutely no excuse for what he did :censored: An inspector is not a vet and isn't qualified to diagnose if an animal is suffering in this instance.
Poor Morky, RIP little fella, xxxxxxxxxx
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Rare or not, once is one too many. This man should be sacked and prosecuted.
Yea i agree
if anyone done that to one of mine id track the :censored: down and kill him ! :( >:( :( >:( :( >:(
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if he didn't make an effort to knock on a few doors and find the owner he probably wouldn't have scanned for a chip anyway.
This is what makes me seriously concerned. Thomas isn't chipped in any event (he is now 17 1/2 and doesn't wander outside garden EVER); as such I ain't chipping my lovely boy now on the chance that some :censored: :censored: RSPCA Inspector, who seems to have lost the plot, gets a hold of him! I know I should have chipped my boy when he was younger but I'm only human and make mistakes. He is very thin now and so is his skin and I don't want to hurt him.
Can I just add that even this will not stop me supporting the local branch of RSPCA with £10 per month as it would only be the animals that would suffer not head office
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He is very thin now and so is his skin and I don't want to hurt him.
I appreciate that the decision is yours and yours alone, however, what I will say is that we chip 8 week old kittens and cats older than 17 and we don't see any different reaction from them than any of the other cats.
Thomas isn't chipped in any event (he is now 17 1/2 and doesn't wander outside garden EVER);
All I can say on this is every week without exception I receive calls from people whose cat has gone missing and they say 'but it never leaves the garden'. Which reminds me of one call which I think I may have posted before. Someone had a blind cat and was telling me about it, I asked if it was an indoor cat and she said no, it never leaves the garden. A few weeks later she phoned me to say her cat had gone missing, I advised her to look at my site and do everything that was advised on my lost and found page. A while later she found the cat had been involved in a RTA and someone had taken it to a vets. Fortunately it survived. She rang to tell me and I said I bet you will keep it in now and she replied, Oh! no it never leaves the garden. I replied but it has just been found on a road run over, she again said but it never leaves the garden.
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The bit that worries me most is that while the rspca admit the inspector didn't follow rspca procedure, they seem to be defending him on grounds that he thought he was acting in the best interests of the cat. If he believed the cat to be suffering then surely he should have taken the cat to a vet asap. An rspca inspector isn't qualified to make a medical decision like that. It's not like the cat had been run over and was lying by the road in obvious pain. And the poor cat was only in his next door neighbour's garden - not like he had wandered off or been missing for a long time.
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By RSPCA standards, should we round up all the OAP's and euthanise them as they are getting on and must need putting out of their misery :scared:
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I'm confused (easy I know) in one part it talks of an Inspector and in another an Animal Collection officer, Two very different jobs.
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I always say that I'm sure there are many good people with the RSPCA, it's the organisation that's the problem, but every time I dee a story like this that argument sounds ever weaker.
I'm no expert, but even I can tell that, if the facts in this news report are correct, there was no pressing need to PTS. Finding a cat badly injured at the side of a road would be one thing, but a cat that happens to be spotted in a garden?!
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I'm confused (easy I know) in one part it talks of an Inspector and in another an Animal Collection officer, Two very different jobs.
Yes - I hadn't noticed that. To begin with it refers to an inspector then towards the end it refers to the employee involved as an animal collection officer. Confusing.
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CP fosterer's should never let cats out anyway, unless of course in a completely cat safe garden. Also all CP cats should now be chipped (which tthe cats you speak about are) . CP HQ have offered free chip training to every CP Branch in the country. CP do not advocate the use of collars.
Sorry Ela, should have made it clear - it's her own oldies she doesn't let out. The CP cats are too well ensconced in their armchairs to want to go out! :evillaugh: All except the 23 year old who doesn't brook any nonsense from anyone. :doh: But then she has a big handsome ginger boy to run shotgun for her!
Back on topic, I wouldn't have thought that an animal collection officer or inspector would have the authority to euthanise an animal unless it was well beyond help. That authority lies solely with a vet.
As an aside to this, when I had my feral pts, I had to sign some forms allowing the vet to carry out the procedure. My understanding of this is that had I and the vet not completed the paperwork, then it would have been illegal to euthanise the cat. So maybe there may be some recourse for Mork's owners through this?
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Sorry Ela, should have made it clear
Please don't apologise, we all, well me anyway post statements that are not quite what we mean
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Anything the RSPCA does doesn't shock me at all - we always hope that we can reach the animal before the RSPCA get their hands on it - I hope Morky's owners successfully prosecute.
Dx
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I am utterly horrified by this article. My oldest girl has no teeth and due to her getting on a little bit her fur isn't as glossy as it used to be (it's still ridiculously soft, though!) and the thought that there are people like this man around that are "allowed" to act this way makes me fuming.
RIP Morky, hope your "parents" get the closure they deserve and need on this awful situation.
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I dont think they would be able to do that Rosella cos I have seen it posted on Purrs before that once the RSPCA take charge of an animal, unlike us, they reguard it as theres to do what they want with it.
I agree with you in that Kocka was 20yrs old when she died and was not chipped but very thin and fragile. She was partially blind , sometimes completely but used to wander down the garden when she felt she wanted to and it only takes one nasty neighbour to report a sick looking cat and under the new welfare law RSPCA coud come and take the cat and presumably summilarily execute it >:( >:( >:(
This was the first thread I looked at today and I am soooooooo very angry, I do hope the papers start taking lots of note of these type of reports.
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:'( :'( :'( OH MY GOD !!!
But it does not surprise me, goes hand in hand with their £50 vets bill or PTS
Many times we were contacted on the QT to take an old cat in as RSPCA were going to PTS -
We also used to get urgent phonecalls from an CP women about old cats and once she had to smuggle a blind cat to us as CP had said PTS
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Its even worse if an ACO can put an animal to sleep. >:(
I still find it shocking that the inspector even went round to the house to collect it, normally strays are to be ignored and "they'll find their own way home"
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Here's a link to the Defra site, about the new law: http://www.defra.gov.uk/animalh/welfare/act/affect.htm (http://www.defra.gov.uk/animalh/welfare/act/affect.htm)
Under "How will the Act be enforced?" it says "However, the RSPCA does not have formal enforcement powers such as power of entry or the power to seize documents."
Even the RSPCA site says "RSPCA inspectors will not have any additional powers under the new Act" yet they still keep promoting the idea that they will.
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I read this story this mornign and cried my eyes out - I cant imagine what those poor people must be going through, my Mum has got a cat who has a thyroid problem and he is really skinny but he is so happy - Mum said today that she thinks she will put a message on his collar saying "I am loved and receiving medical attention - please dont put me to sleep"
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I think very wise
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I read this story this mornign and cried my eyes out - I cant imagine what those poor people must be going through, my Mum has got a cat who has a thyroid problem and he is really skinny but he is so happy - Mum said today that she thinks she will put a message on his collar saying "I am loved and receiving medical attention - please dont put me to sleep"
It really has come to something when you have to do this >:(
That article has made me furious, and unbearably sad - that poor kitty (what a darling), and its poor 'parents', and its sibling ... it is totally shocking. Unbelievable incompetence! It makes me wonder if this inspector took some sort of pleasure in killing animals because how on EARTH could anyone who actually cares do what he did? And to kill little Morky in his own front garden .... what???
Oh and Ela, I know the CP don't advocate collars, but if people don't check for microchips as a matter of course, then a collar spells it loud and clear .... "I own somebody". Which is why mine wear one. I hate the damn things, but I couldn't bear for anyone to take any of mine away thinking they were strays.
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.... but if people don't check for microchips as a matter of course, then a collar spells it loud and clear .... "I own somebody". Which is why mine wear one. I hate the damn things, but I couldn't bear for anyone to take any of mine away thinking they were strays.
Snap! Same reason mine wear them. I would hate someone assuming they were strays and bundling them off to the nearest rescue!
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.... but if people don't check for microchips as a matter of course, then a collar spells it loud and clear .... "I own somebody". Which is why mine wear one. I hate the damn things, but I couldn't bear for anyone to take any of mine away thinking they were strays.
Snap! Same reason mine wear them. I would hate someone assuming they were strays and bundling them off to the nearest rescue!
I hate collars but would recommend them for the same reason. If I saw a cat on the street with a collar on, I would assume it's more than likely that someone owns them, if they have no collar, people tend to think they are a stray.
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normally strays are to be ignored and "they'll find their own way home"
Wish I had a £1 for every time someone had phoned me and advised me that is exactly what they have been told.
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I agree with collars for outdoor cats for this reason, but collars can and do come off. The rspca should know better than to assume a cat without a collar is a stray.
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I know the CP don't advocate collars, but if people don't check for microchips as a matter of course, then a collar spells it loud and clear .... "I own somebody".
When people find a cat or think they find a cat, we always ask the finder to take to a vet to see if it is chipped or if they live near one of our fosters to them. Nowadays most rescues, all vets and some Councils have readers. I know also that more and more vets are now scanning cats as they come into the surgery to ensure the owner is the owner. The down side to me is that apart from the horrific injuries I see due to collars, a collar does not necessarily say 'I own somebody' ( ;D I like that). So many cats that are strays come into care that have collars on and in spite of our best efforts we fail to find an owner. Sometimes we find out that the owner has moved and just left the cat or the owner has died and the family had put the cat out but of course all the other household possessions have been found a good home. I would hate for people who see a cat with a collar on to assume it has a home. If they did many cats would be strays for a long time.
my Mum has got a cat who has a thyroid problem and he is really skinny but he is so happy - Mum said today that she thinks she will put a message on his collar saying "I am loved and receiving medical attention - please don’t put me to sleep"
A year or so ago someone signed over a very thin cat over to us (we later found out that the 'finder' knew perfectly well who the owner was but that is a different story.) If another certain rescue in our area did take in strays (which they don't) the little one would most certainly have been PTS within the hour. Anyway we took the cat to the vets immediately and had full bloods, apart from the thyroid test which takes a few days for the results to come back the results were quite good for a cat of its age. Sadly a few days later the cat died. We found out it was on medication for thyroid but because some :censored: of a neighbour thought the cat was not being cared for it did not receive its medication, who knows it may have died anyway but it just leaves that niggle in the back of your mind and of course its owner would have been able to be with the little one at the end. Had the cat been chipped rather than a collar with no identification on (it had come off) the cat would have been reunited with its owner and a letter to the 'finder' sent saying it was a much loved pet.
Anyway back to the original topic, I do hope that lessons will be learn from this and that all in the Society are informed about it and advised that they really do need to take a pet to the nearest vet immediately, then go back (unless they have another emergency) to the area it was found and make a few enquiries.
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Just discussing with OH whether to chip Tom and was telling him about this thread and whether we should in fact collar all 3 in case someone thinks they are strays. He said "Oh yea, I can just see someone thinking Freddie is a stray". I said "You'd be surprised how bad he might look if caught in the rain and got his white fur all muddy" OH said "I'd be surprised if he were caught in the rain" :rofl:
Seriously, Ela I'll consider chipping Tom at next vet visit. As a side issue, I have been corresponding with local council re checking RTAs for chips so that owners can be informed. I live in Birmingham so the number of RTAs for our council will be high and I've given them contact details for Helen's council who have a scheme up and running. We have a pilot scheme at the moment and I will be chasing them soon for an update.
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When I found out our Council did not have a reader I was just about to contact them and ask if they would have one if we provided it, when they went and purchased one themselves. [ ;D
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When I joined this forum I had no idea it was so anti RSPCA. I had thought it was just about cats & cat rescue. How wrong can you be!
I am going to try not to visit any more because it is not doing my blood pressure any good.
Now as I see it this ACO pts a very elderly cat. He did not abuse/torture/abandon it though you would think he had reading some of the posts.
I assume the reason for starting this thread was to deliberate whip up more anti RSPCA feeling. People took the bait, & on the strength of one newspaper article people seem prepared to act as judge, jury and executioner.
I don't know about anyone else but I don't take everything I read in the newspaper at face value. Yes is makes a good headline "Pet cat murdered by the RSPCA" but there is always more to it.
It is ironic that this is a case of an old cat and a neighbour - just the scenario I suggested in another RSPCA thread.
As I said then I think some people call out the RSPCA too readily, if this next door neighbour had done what she should have done and asked around about the cat first this would not have happened. After all she would not have to look very far would she.
Of course she has received no criticism (not part of the RSPCA). Why? We seem to live in a society where individuals want no personal responsibility. Far easier to just make a telephone call and put the ball in someone else's court. Much easier than having to walk up and down the road and actually do something. The RSPCA can do that they have all the time in the world.
The owner says the cat was fine but at 19 the cat could go down hill fast.
Who knows what condition the cat was in I did not see it, I do not know. I do know some people have very different ideas about cats health and welfare. On a number of occassions we have had very old cats brought in to the cattery to be boarded and I have been shocked at their condition. Both Maureen, the cattery owner and myself have said If this were my cat I would have had it put to sleep yet the owners are prepared to let them carry on as long as there is breath in their body , no matter how frail, senile, thin or immobile they are.
Yes I get upset and annoyed because the criticism is nearly always aimed at "The RSPCA" as an organisation and as someone who is a member of and does rescue work for the RSPCA I do take it personally. If you say The RSPCA is uncaring and incompetent you are suggesting I am uncaring and incompetent.
I am starting to realise what it must be like to be part of an ethnic minority and it isn't nice.
I really find this hatred of the RSPCA unfathomable. The vitriol should be aimed at those who abuse their animals/abandon their animals/neglect their animals/breed irresponsibly etc.
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This is apalling, the owners must be devastated.
How on earth this person came to the decision that this cat, with no visible illness or injury, was ill and suffering and euthanized on that basis purely because he was old and thin is unthinkable. Tiggy went to the vets every month in the last 18 months of her life, she was thin and clearly elderly but had no obvious injury or illness, and I might add a good quality of life - not once in all those times was it suggested or advocated that she be PTS. How an individual of a supposed caring society could think differently beggars belief.
RIP Mork x
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Lindy, I can see what you are getting at. However...
This particular incident revolves around the fact that the person who euthanised this particular cat did not have the authority to do so - irrespective of whether they were an RSPCA employee or otherwise. According to procedure, the cat should have been taken to a veterinarian to be examined had there been any concerns whatsoever about its health an condition - this officer should not have taken matters into his / her own hands.
The decision whether to euthanise should lie solely with a qualified veterinarian and be only carried out with the full permission and consent of the owner.
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When I joined this forum I had no idea it was so anti RSPCA. I had thought it was just about cats & cat rescue. How wrong can you be!
We are not anti RSPCA, but if they or indeed any rescue does anything that is not right it is and needs to be reported and discussed. I have seen posted bad comments about CP occasionally, but I don't take it to heart, I just advise what our branch would have done in the situation and perhaps how the matter can be resolved. We cannot just praise the good a rescue does but bury our heads in the sand when something goes wrong and keep quiet.
The owner says the cat was fine but at 19 the cat could go down hill fast.
It could, equally it could have had a few more years of quality life, just because a cat is old it does not mean it has less right to live than a younger cat. Sadly simlar situations like this are reported up and down the county on a regular basis. I know I too have be advised of such cases more than once.
he vitriol should be aimed at those who abuse their animals/abandon their animals/neglect their animals/breed irresponsibly etc.
Could it not be called abuse if you PTS a pet before a vet decide its time has come?
As I said then I think some people call out the RSPCA too readily, if this next door neighbour had done what she should have done and asked around about the cat first this would not have happened. After all she would not have to look very far would she.
I have to agree that people do often call a rescue when they could solve a problem themselves very quickly, however, the bottom line is if they can't be bothered we need to do something. Also we must not discourage people from contacting rescues as very often it is a genuine emergency.
Why? We seem to live in a society where individuals want no personal responsibility. Far easier to just make a telephone call and put the ball in someone else's court. Much easier than having to walk up and down the road and actually do something. The RSPCA can do that they have all the time in the world.
We in rescue choose to help the little ones because we want to make a difference, we cannot make others have a responsibilty and what they do with their time is up to them.
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im sorry but i agree with lindy about the rspca they aint that bad! are they !?!
but this story about the officer putting to sleep someones much loved cat is a disgrace i agree.
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When I joined this forum I had no idea it was so anti RSPCA. I had thought it was just about cats & cat rescue. How wrong can you be!
I am going to try not to visit any more because it is not doing my blood pressure any good.
The forum is certainly not anti RSPCA, individual members raised their concerns about RSPCA policies and documented incidents that have taken place. I'm sorry that you feel that you don't want to use this site any longer, I have different opinions to others on this site but am still able to visit despite our differences of opinion and I hope you will come to that same decision.
Now as I see it this ACO pts a very elderly cat. He did not abuse/torture/abandon it though you would think he had reading some of the posts.
I assume the reason for starting this thread was to deliberate whip up more anti RSPCA feeling. People took the bait, & on the strength of one newspaper article people seem prepared to act as judge, jury and executioner.
I don't know about anyone else but I don't take everything I read in the newspaper at face value. Yes is makes a good headline "Pet cat murdered by the RSPCA" but there is always more to it.
Whilst I agree the headline of the article could be seen as inflammatory the facts of the case are clear as detailed in the response from the RSPCA itself, they admit that a 'mistake' was made and indeed the individual involved has been the subject of disciplinary action.
It is ironic that this is a case of an old cat and a neighbour - just the scenario I suggested in another RSPCA thread.
As I said then I think some people call out the RSPCA too readily, if this next door neighbour had done what she should have done and asked around about the cat first this would not have happened. After all she would not have to look very far would she.
Of course she has received no criticism (not part of the RSPCA). Why? We seem to live in a society where individuals want no personal responsibility. Far easier to just make a telephone call and put the ball in someone else's court. Much easier than having to walk up and down the road and actually do something. The RSPCA can do that they have all the time in the world.
Yes, the neighbour could have been more proactive in locating an owner herself but her intentions were only good, I personally cannot see how any 'blame' could be laid on her shoulders. It was an individual acting under the banner of the RSPCA that made this 'mistake'. The neighbour purely voiced her concerns.
The owner says the cat was fine but at 19 the cat could go down hill fast.
Who knows what condition the cat was in I did not see it, I do not know. I do know some people have very different ideas about cats health and welfare. On a number of occassions we have had very old cats brought in to the cattery to be boarded and I have been shocked at their condition. Both Maureen, the cattery owner and myself have said If this were my cat I would have had it put to sleep yet the owners are prepared to let them carry on as long as there is breath in their body , no matter how frail, senile, thin or immobile they are.
Please see my previous post, my 19 year old who I sadly lost very recently was 'old and thin'. She had a good quality of life, was happy and purred her little head off every morning while we cuddled up on the pillow - my vet saw no reason to advise PTS on the basis of age and weight.
Yes I get upset and annoyed because the criticism is nearly always aimed at "The RSPCA" as an organisation and as someone who is a member of and does rescue work for the RSPCA I do take it personally. If you say The RSPCA is uncaring and incompetent you are suggesting I am uncaring and incompetent.
I am starting to realise what it must be like to be part of an ethnic minority and it isn't nice.
I really find this hatred of the RSPCA unfathomable. The vitriol should be aimed at those who abuse their animals/abandon their animals/neglect their animals/breed irresponsibly etc.
I'm sorry that you are taking other people's opinions on the organisation of the RSPCA personally, I can assure you this is not the case. I myself don't recall ever commenting on a thread about the actions of the RSPCA in the past, this particular incident has touched my heart and I feel terribly sorry for Mork and his owners, this does not mean that you should feel attacked by my or any other persons comments about the RSPCA in general.
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If anything, many of us are disappointed with the orgaisation, not just for letting animals down, as in this most recent case, but for letting their own members and supporters down. Every time a story like this appears, it betrays the reason the RSPCA was founded, and even if these cases are in the minority, as I hope and believe, very little seems to be done to try and prevent further "mistakes".
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I am starting to realise what it must be like to be part of an ethnic minority and it isn't nice.
I don't think you really are seeing that it's like to be part of an ethnic minority and I am offended you have used such a comparison to assume that everyone who is part of an ethnic minority feels like they don't fit in or their opinions are different to everyone elses.
I think what you are failing to realise is that yes this is a cat rescue forum and yes we all love cats. But you'll also find that at a guess over half of us have had a negative dealing with the RSPCA. I don't think you are really in a position to judge everyone on here because in life we all make our own opinions on things that happen to us and things we know about. I didn't read one thread about the RSPCA and decide to hate them overnight. I've heard so many cases and then last year personality helped on two cases and heard first hand of another about how awful the RSPCA are. If the RSPCA had had their way one of my cats wouldnt be here today, it's only because of an angel of a member of staff putting her foot down and rescuing him, from a rescue.
The indendant RSPCAs are completely different from the HQ who I know for a fact that they pour thousands if not millions annually into trying to get us to give them money and sending idiots round to knock on our doors. When you give a donation you want it to help an animal not just be wasted on printing some fundraising literature.
Overall I don't think you are in a position to question how any of us feel, if you'd seen the cases we'd seen, heard the horror stories and gasped at disbelief at the UK's "top" animal charity, perhaps you would change your mind.
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Lindy - I'm amazed you think anything about this case is excusable. I'm not anti rspca in general (ie I'm sure there are lots of good people working for them and individual branches that do good work) but there are too many of these kind of stories to dismiss them as one off mistakes. I'm disappointed more than anything with rspca hq and with the organisation's apparent willingness to put healthy animals to sleep or rehome them with undue haste.
As I stated in my initial post, if the facts in the report are correct this particular instance is inexcusable. Even the rspca do concede that the officer did not follow rspca procedure. According to the article the cat wasn't in particularly poor health and the fact that he had no teeth seems to have been the main reason for the officer deciding the cat was unwell and should be pts there and then without even getting a vet to check him out. The owner claims that his coat was in good condition and his claws were newly trimmed. There's no indication that the cat was suffering and has been stated by others - a vet should be the person to decide that anyway. I can't think of any justification for not a) getting the cat to a vet if the officer believed him to be unwell and b) returning to the area to ask around re ownership. The cat was only in the neighbour's garden! The reason no-one has criticised the neighbour is, presumably, because it states in the report that the neighbour was new to the area and I would assume she would have no idea that the cat would be pts there and then. Yes she probably should have asked around before calling the rspca but she is not responsible for the cat's death.
In the past I've always been cautious of criticising the rspca or anyone else, especially based on 2nd or 3rd hand reports. But this seems a clear cut case and the rspca are not denying the facts.
I should also add that Desley recently posted a very favourable thread about her local rspca branch - we don't just post the bad stuff.
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How tragically sad for Mork to be taken away from his home to be MURDERED by a so called animal welfare officer. His little sister must be so sad and especially his Mummy and Daddy.
I have no sympathy whatsoever for the neighbour as she should have bothered to ask around first and foremost
I have twins that are 25 years old they have little teeth and are thin but like Mork and Mindy are loved and cared for and always will be until they leave for Rainbow bridge
The so called animal welfare officer should be sacked from EVER having a position like this again .
I have myself in the past telephoned the RSPCA relating to an injured fox, 3 starved ponies and a dog that we could see had such bad matting around its bottom and flies.... THEY NEVER CAME OUT TO ANY OF THEM I have no respect for them at all. I like anyone on here put my anmals first and foremost and the above s my opinion which I am entitle to
RIP little Mork play hard at the bridge
xx
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When I joined this forum I had no idea it was so anti RSPCA. I had thought it was just about cats & cat rescue. How wrong can you be!
I am going to try not to visit any more because it is not doing my blood pressure any good.
Now as I see it this ACO pts a very elderly cat. He did not abuse/torture/abandon it though you would think he had reading some of the posts.
I assume the reason for starting this thread was to deliberate whip up more anti RSPCA feeling. People took the bait, & on the strength of one newspaper article people seem prepared to act as judge, jury and executioner.
I don't know about anyone else but I don't take everything I read in the newspaper at face value. Yes is makes a good headline "Pet cat murdered by the RSPCA" but there is always more to it.
It is ironic that this is a case of an old cat and a neighbour - just the scenario I suggested in another RSPCA thread.
As I said then I think some people call out the RSPCA too readily, if this next door neighbour had done what she should have done and asked around about the cat first this would not have happened. After all she would not have to look very far would she.
Of course she has received no criticism (not part of the RSPCA). Why? We seem to live in a society where individuals want no personal responsibility. Far easier to just make a telephone call and put the ball in someone else's court. Much easier than having to walk up and down the road and actually do something. The RSPCA can do that they have all the time in the world.
The owner says the cat was fine but at 19 the cat could go down hill fast.
Who knows what condition the cat was in I did not see it, I do not know. I do know some people have very different ideas about cats health and welfare. On a number of occassions we have had very old cats brought in to the cattery to be boarded and I have been shocked at their condition. Both Maureen, the cattery owner and myself have said If this were my cat I would have had it put to sleep yet the owners are prepared to let them carry on as long as there is breath in their body , no matter how frail, senile, thin or immobile they are.
Yes I get upset and annoyed because the criticism is nearly always aimed at "The RSPCA" as an organisation and as someone who is a member of and does rescue work for the RSPCA I do take it personally. If you say The RSPCA is uncaring and incompetent you are suggesting I am uncaring and incompetent.
I am starting to realise what it must be like to be part of an ethnic minority and it isn't nice.
I really find this hatred of the RSPCA unfathomable. The vitriol should be aimed at those who abuse their animals/abandon their animals/neglect their animals/breed irresponsibly etc.
Do you actually have cats of your Own Lindy
Imagine you were Morks owner if you have cats
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I've actually done placement at an RSPCA shelter for six months, Lindy and have to say I was extremely unimpressed by the staff and their attitude to the animals there. The bare minimum was done - the pens and runs were cleaned and the animals were put in the run from the pens. That's it. It probably took about an hour to do each block in total. The rest of the time the employees were basically loitering around being snidey about each other. (and me quite a lot!)
There was no socialising especially, and if a "problem" animal was brought in it was not given any time to try and fathom why it was behaving the way it was. The case that springs to mind for me was a 'semi feral' cat that was brought in, who I was made to wear gauntlets for if I went in his pen. I took them off after I was in there and sat on the floor with him and he was not only ridiculously unsure of what was happening, but also drinking vast amounts of water. I got them to test him and it transpired he was diabetic. He was given a short amount of time on the adoption block and then PTS. :( About a week after a gay couple came in specifying they wanted a house cat with a health issue to pamper and give lots of love to; I was really upset and cried a lot when I went home that night. And that's just one of the cases.
I even got left in charge of the cattery towards the end of my placement (entirely illegal, I was supposed to be supervised assistance)and I was really chuffed because after I'd done all the necessary cleaning, I'd put a sign on the door saying "caution-cat loose" and let each cat have time out of their pen wandering about where the visitors were. :) (This was safe as any cats with a transferable illness weren't kept on the section.)
I think it's a tough call, but the guy was blatantly too quick to make the decision on whether to end a cats life due to its age. I find that an inexcusable action. And yes, the neighbour could've done more but shouldn't she be able to trust the people who are supposed to care for an animals welfare to explore all possible avenues and then hold the animal before this sort of drastic action is taken?
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http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=454396&in_page_id=1770&in_page_id=1770&expand=true#StartComments
made the daily mail today
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I am very pleased the papers are picking this up and looking at the comments to the paper, like Hels said many have had bad experiences with the RSPCA.
This is the first time to my knowledge............please correct me if I am wrong........thats the nationals have dared to openly criticise this organization, so hopefully now a push will be made to stop the cavelier attitude that their HQ, call centre and some of their inspectors have.
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I have just read some of the comments and people are withdrawing their contributions to the RSPCA. Maybe they should re-direct some to the CPL who definatly could do with some funds for all their good caring honest work WHERE THE ANIMALS COME FIRST EVERY TIME
WELL DONE TO YOU ALL
XX
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The sad thing is because of this idiot, the whole of the RSPCA will be tarred with the same brush yet again :sigh: There are good and bad in every job and if all the donations are withdrawn, what happens to all those poor animals that are already in their care? The money has to come from somewhere to pay for them.
Smudge, I have come across some :censored: who work for the CPL as well, so as already said, there is good and bad in every job.........we can't tar them all with the same brush.
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I do tend to agree with Dawn on that. It's not the organisation, it's specific people.
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i find this news item terrifying. i cant believe they havent sacked this guy but maybe with all this negative publicity the RSPCA HQ will have a rethink on some of its policies
i have only had a few encounter with the RSPCA but they havent come off well in any.
1) a few years ago there was a pigeon i kept seeing in town, with an obvious leg injury, huddled in the same corner, i rang the rspca 4 times, no action rang the AARU, picked up same day. i know its only a pigeon but it still has a right to a life without suffering
2) when i met my darling , lucifer, (possible stray) the RSPCA werent interested in taking any details of a found cat. i had to keep asking the woman to make note on their system. the CPL and AARU however took full details and many i hadnt thought about.
3) i saw a dead cat on the roadside. i rang the CPl in tears, the woman i spoke to was very understanding and took all the details, she also rang the council for me. the AARU also took all details. the RSPCA people couldnt seem to understand why i was ringing them. she just kept saying "so its, dead?" i understand that lost and found isnt their main function but for the sake of adding it into a computer system so if the owners start looking for him/her they will have closure, its not really a big ask is it.
4)i have a used but clean and functional hamster/rat cage i wanted to donate. the rspca pretty much told me to go forth and multiply. id have thought it might have been of some use, or at least a polite no thanks, we cant use that.
so ive not found them to be very caring and tbh, a wasted phone call. thats not to say every centres the same or every person that works for them.
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Snarf, in these instances, was it the National number you called or the local branch?
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national for 2 and 3 , 1 and 4 were the local number.i think. if i had called the wrong place though surely they should tell me?
if ive offended you (or anyone) im sorry, just sharing.
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Hey, no offence.......when they are not doing the job they are meant to, these problems need highlighting. I'm just asking as when you phone the National number, you are dealing with a call centre not the RSPCA.....these peeps get paid for doing a job but are not directly involved.....they are there to pass the info on to the inspectors and to give advice but sadly, they can't do this properly and quite often get this wrong.
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blimey hadnt realised that. so like all call centres theres some employees that know what theyre doing and some that really dont. i think the AARU is mainly manned by volunteers, not sure about the Cpl bt that could be why they were more helpful, either that or i was just lucky
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blimey hadnt realised that. so like all call centres theres some employees that know what theyre doing and some that really dont. i think the AARU is mainly manned by volunteers, not sure about the Cpl bt that could be why they were more helpful, either that or i was just lucky
This is what I keep trying to drum into people........they are paid to do a job, but not necessarily all are animal lovers. The RSPCA get a lot of flak because of the way the call centre deal with calls, this is down to the call centre not the RSPCA.
If, when you phone the National Number, you are not happy with what they tell you, ring again and hopefully you will get someone who's human on the end of the phone and who is more than happy to help and give proper advice.........don't accept what they tell you the first time if it sounds like poppy fluffybanana.
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Sorry Dawn but beg to disagree.
This is a call cenrtre working for the RSPCA and it is up to the RSPCA to get it working properly.
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I personally think the RSPCA are and should be responsible for the way calls are dealt with even if it means listening in on employees calls from time to time (to keep them on their toes and dealing with them accordingly should they not deal with the calls with compasion and professionalism AT ALL TIMES. I'm afraid I have spoken to them as I said before and have got the "yeah whatever" attitude
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We've had numerous discussions about the call centre staff at our meetings, the way to change things is to write in to the HQ and voice your complaints.......this is the only way things are going to change. If peeps don't say anything, crap advice will continue to be given and animals will continue to suffer in the process. Rather than slating on a forum, do something in writing to the HQ and slowly, things should change for the better but don't hold your breath, just in case :shify:
I've had numerous dealings with call centre staff and I've nearly always ended up phoning up again until I've been happy with their response.......in all instances, this has worked.
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I personally think the RSPCA are and should be responsible for the way calls are dealt with even if it means listening in on employees calls from time to time (to keep them on their toes and dealing with them accordingly should they not deal with the calls with compasion and professionalism AT ALL TIMES. I'm afraid I have spoken to them as I said before and have got the "yeah whatever" attitude
Our chairperson has on occasion phoned the call centre for various things to see how she's been dealt with, sadly they have been faultless in their dealings but I have mentioned a few dealings I have had myself and also got names of the peeps I've spoken to.
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don't accept what they tell you the first time if it sounds like poppy Banana.
how would a random member of the general public know though? thats not just levelled at the RSPCA either, the NHS lines abit "interesting" at times, i rang when i dislocated my kneecap, was told to rest it for a few days. i didnt know she was just a random lady, when i rang back a few days later, still in agony i was told i should have been put through to a nurse/doctor and only they are supposed to give advice (i went to hospital and was in a brace for 4 weeks, crutches for 4 weeks after, clearly bad advice there too!) and yes i ring too many helplines! :shy:
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sounds like they need a decent chairperson like you Dawn we could all vote for you ....maybe we should all email the address voicing our concerns if one little life is saved through everyone emailing then its all worth it
Do you have the appropriate address Dawn
Well done for all you do :hug:
x
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don't accept what they tell you the first time if it sounds like poppy Banana.
how would a random member of the general public know though?
They wouldn't but in saying that, I don't listen to any old crap told to me over the phone, and if I'm not happy, I will persue it until I am. If an animal is suffering, we have to be their voice but sadly not everyone is interested enough to help, they want to finish their shift, get home and forget about it......for some of us, this isn't that easy. But again as already mentioned, there are some really nice peeps who do answer the phones and they will do their utmost to help.........it's just a case of keep trying until you get someone you're happy with, I know this shouldn't be the case but sadly, in my experience it is.
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sounds like they need a decent chairperson like you Dawn we could all vote for you
errr, no thanks :Crazy: Going to monthly meetings is stressful enough :shify:
maybe we should all email the address voicing our concerns if one little life is saved through everyone emailing then its all worth it
This is the only way to change things you are not happy with......in my opinion anyway ;)
Do you have the appropriate address Dawn
I will sort out the HQ address for you.
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not sure about the Cpl bt that could be why they were more helpful, either that or i was just lucky
All Cats Protection Branches (260+) are run by unpaid slaves volunteers. . There are also some (less than 30) HQ sponsored shelters which do employ some paid staff and also have some volunteers. These tend to have a capacity for more cats than a branch and in one case about 200 cats.
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Lindy - I am sorry you have those views and I dont think you should leave the forum - articles like this will get us talking and seeming anti-RSPCA, but if it was the CP, my reaction would have been the same, dont know about anyone else's. As Susanne pointed out, I have been posting favourable things about the RSPCA recently - sadly, it is the rescue's local branch and not my own, but there is a massive difference in the two, and I will be helping their local one and not my own, I am hopefully going to be fostering oldies for them at some point, and we have up to 4 more fundraisers this year thanks to them, so I will continue to praise them. I think more people should go to their local branch and talk to the people in charge, esp when you dont agree with one of their policies - still dont agree with one of my local branch's policies, but if you actually talk to them and find out their reasoning behind it, you then can't have a go at them for it - and I wouldn't want to be in their position, having members of hte public being rude and aggressive to them because they are full and can't take in their animal, or dealing with them dumped on the doorstep cos they said no. The impression I got about the call centre was that they are people that might not be manning the RSPCA line every day, so they aren't always qualified knowledgable people - but you get that in every single call centre, so maybe just keep ringing back and getting someone who can help - or develop a relationship with your local branch, so you know you can ring them (i.e. I have the out of hours no for the rescue's local branch)
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but if it was the CP, my reaction would have been the same, dont know about anyone else's.
Quite right too. I would have been on to HQ immediately.
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- or develop a relationship with your local branch, so you know you can ring them (i.e. I have the out of hours no for the rescue's local branch
The fact that you have there number is not much good to the 'normal' people who may need help as obviously you cannot give it out, so unless a person knew you or another member they could still have problems in an emergency.
I must say that your branch seems better than many, unfortunately many local branches are not so good. Our Local branch only takes calls for 6 hours a day, 6 days a week and if anyone reported a RTA for instance they don't want to know and would advise you to contact the National number. The rest of the time there is just a message asking you to leave your name and number, when I would have thought they should refer callers to the National number for emergencies at least.
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We can't even get hold of our local branch number, they won't give it to us even though we are CP,so we always have to ring the national helpline.
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We can't even get hold of our local branch number, they won't give it to us even though we are CP,so we always have to ring the national helpline.
That is a disgrace, apart from visiting then no one can get hold of them. At least I have the ex directory number for phone and fax if I need to get them during their opening hours to the public and if the phone is constantly engaged on the published number.
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We can't even get hold of our local branch number,
If you are in Gateshead is not the 0191 477 5999 in use now?
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I don't think so but I will investigate that thanks. Another thing we have found recently is that in this region at least the National Helpline no isn't in any of the phone books, yellow pages, Thomson directory etc so the general public can't find it easily. Ours is in there so of course people ring us instead and the lady who does our phone ends off ringing the helpline for them. I know our RDM is currently working on improving links with them in our region so hopefully things will improve in the near future. It just seems daft that we don't work together more.