Topic: Continuing problems with Charlie UPDATED WITH PIC (Read 6884 times)

Maddiesmum · « **Reply #62 on:** January 12, 2009, 14:02:50 PM »

I am lucky with my vet Irene, she is very very sympathetic to the behaviour issues and has tried to come up with lots of suggestions to help. She also gives me tips on how to calm my anxiety. I now have an appointment with Sarah for Tuesday 20th at 4.30 and it will be a 2-3 hour home visit with 12 months ongoing telephone support. Her secretary said Sarah is a very straight speaking person and will tell me if she thinks Charlie will never come to terms with his situation but she said obviously she will try and come up with a behaviour modication programme to help him. I rang my insurers who will cover £250 of the cost (I suppose less the excess of £50) so that will help and fingers crossed something can be sorted wihout me having to rehome him which would devaste me.

He is calmer today although has had a couple of small skitzy bits which were probably mad half hours more than anything. He is still bitey if I pet him though. He has had a few games with me with different toys and has now gone upstairs for his afternoon snooze. It's interesting to note that last night my neighbour's cat Sophie (the one Charlie hates) was up on the fence clawing away at the spot where the strange cat had been sitting. Territories eh?

swampmaxmum · « **Reply #61 on:** January 12, 2009, 12:31:31 PM »

Your vet sees Charlie for just a few minutes, during which he's not having one of his episodes. Perhaps if you could take a video (even if too dark) he would see what you are on about. Most vets hate behaviour issues as can't really deal with them. Keep on at the vet and ask how he would treat it if it was hyperesthesia - surely it can't be a disaster to try something to see if it helps as right now you are struggling?!
I know how difficult it is sometimes with even the best vet, they have blind spots - mine just will not ring up a neurologist to ask what they think, despite saying he's no neuro expert. And we can't ring up vets ourselves.

hope today is a lot more relaxing

xxx

Maddiesmum · « **Reply #60 on:** January 11, 2009, 20:56:50 PM »

This cat is new to the area, none of us know it. It has only been seen this last day or so and I think today was the first time for Charlie. He is manic every few days, different things set him off and sometimes nothing. This week there has been the snow/frost, window cleaner, cat and now wind (he always goes off when it's windy). He has almost all the symptoms of hyperesthesia save for the chewing at his tail. His tail constantly twitches, his fur ripples, his pupils dilate, he is over receptive to touch and sound, he runs hither and thither like a madcat he is more vocal. I am going to discuss it further with the behaviourist as my vet doesn't seem to think it is hyperesthesia. One of the vets at the practice did suggest it as a vague possibility a while ago but it all sort of got pushed to one side. It will be good having a long home visit from a vet/behaviourist as time is always limited when you visit the vet isn't it? There's always loads waiting etc. Anyway he is calm right now, he has been on the desk for a cuddle and is all sweetness now he has worn himself out. It is certainly worrying. It comes on gradually sometimes and his behaviour has been much worse since he had his ear wash in terms of frequency. Hyperesthesia can be triggered by anaesthetic too. Apparently it can't be diagnosed outright, it has to come from ruling out other possibilities after tests. Why do I want to scream?

swampmaxmum · « **Reply #59 on:** January 11, 2009, 19:24:56 PM »

I'm so sorry and hope that he's calmed down. Do you think he has a kitty friend - or enemy - that he wants to get to, not just the field? (the black and white visitor). That could be the trigger for his behaviour. Hard though it is, I think you'll just have to let him tire himself out as it sounds like he's going to bite or scratch you if you intervene - as long as he can't hurt himself I mean. What percentage of the time is he manic and what more calm and playful? Can you see it coming on, or is it like a switch flicks in his head?

to you and to Charlie xxx

Skiddaw · « **Reply #58 on:** January 11, 2009, 16:48:02 PM »

I wonder if cats can have ADHD? His behaviour sounds very much like it.

bonnielass · « **Reply #57 on:** January 11, 2009, 16:31:45 PM »

OMG i dont have any advise just a barrel of hugs to you and hope you get this sorted asap

Kirst · « **Reply #56 on:** January 11, 2009, 16:23:16 PM »

Oh poor you. I dont have any contructove advice Im afraid so have some of these.

Maddiesmum · « **Reply #55 on:** January 11, 2009, 16:12:59 PM »

Have had a dreadful afternoon with Charlie. This morning before I went to the Dogs Home I fed him, played with him and let him in the garden for a while. When I looked out of the window there was a strange (not odd strange) black and white cat trying to get into the garden and pushing on the netting. Charlie was trying to get up the fence to it. I opened the door and the cat ran off. That really set Charlie off but I had to go to work so quickly had a mad dash play with him and went at 08.45. When I got home about 1.15 I fussed him and then had a lot of paperwork to do on the computer. He went in and out the garden then did one of his big freak outs. He scares me when he does it because I am not sure if he is going to hurt himself or even drive himself to the point of collapse. Anyway he leapt on my desk and I picked him up to put him back on the floor and he turned quite vicious, biting me and swiped my face. I decided to just let him get on with it and he went in the kitchen, knocked his litter tray and shredded the kitchen roll. Then skidded round the house again until 3.30 when he zonked. Please believe me when I tell you this behaviour is not the normal mad half hour it is absolute dementia. He is like a cat possessed and he meows a lot when he stops running. I can't wait much longer for this appointment before one of us cracks up completely.

swampmaxmum · « **Reply #54 on:** January 10, 2009, 23:01:18 PM »

hope he's calmer tonight. Window cleaners must be quite scary actually! xxx

Gill (sneakiefeline) · « **Reply #53 on:** January 10, 2009, 20:14:05 PM »

I am sure the window cleaner did as he was an intruder on Charlies patch

Maddiesmum · « **Reply #52 on:** January 10, 2009, 15:24:03 PM »

I don't know Gill but keeping the diary has been useful so far as it is easier to see a sort of pattern. He is a bit skitzy today has been frosty and the window cleaner has upset him too I think.

Gill (sneakiefeline) · « **Reply #51 on:** January 10, 2009, 12:45:01 PM »

Maybe the cold gives him earache or maybe he just doesnt like the cold?

Maddiesmum · « **Reply #50 on:** January 10, 2009, 12:43:20 PM »

I wonder how long it will be before I get the appointment? Vet said early in the week she has referred us. One thing I have noticed with Charlie is that his behaviour seems to deteriorate if it is snowy/frosty. Might be co-incidence or might be a connection? Also he does a lot of head shaking when he is in the odd mood. Wonder if its connected

Gill (sneakiefeline) · « **Reply #49 on:** January 07, 2009, 23:56:29 PM »

I agree with what is said below, especially if a behaviourist does not look at each animal as a seperate case and treat them as such.

I do hate when psychologists shove all people into identical boxes and expect everyone to have the same pattern of behavior, likewise for animal behaviorists. Cats are such individual characters as you can tell by everything said on Purrs.

I have 4 cats and each one is totally different, even the two brothers

Susanne (urbantigers) · « **Reply #48 on:** January 07, 2009, 23:52:18 PM »

Tbh, I've never been that keen on Peter Neville. He writes for one of the cat mags and I've read stuff of his before. I'm not saying he doesn't know his stuff in terms of feline behaviour, but I've always found his approach to be very inflexible. Not exactly thinking outside the box, if you get my meaning. He's involved in solving an individual behaviour problem each month in one of the cat mags (or was until recently) and whenever a cat is an indoor cat he never misses an opportunity to say that that is the reason for the problem, before he seems to have assessed the case fully. He seems to be opposed to indoor cats and while I appreciate that his opinion on that will, to some extent, be formed by his years of study and behaviour consultations, I do feel that it's also partly a case of having a personal opinion and being unprepared to accept solutions that dont' support his opinion. Not saying he's rubbish or anything like that, or that Sarah Heath will be either, but do bear that in mind when reading his book and don't take everything he says too much to heart. I don't believe that it's impossible for a free roaming cat to adapt to a confined lifestyle. I have read enough cases where people have successfully done that to make me believe it is possible, if not for all cats.

And stop feeling guilty. You have done nothing wrong. Quite the opposite. You have given a homeless cat a loving home. The fact that you are so upset about this is because you love Charlie and want the best for him. But please try not to get too focussed on what you think you have deprived him of. Because then, all you will see is the problems and you will get everything out of proportion. I'm not under-estimating the problems Charlie has on his bad days, but please dont' blame yourself. Remember that there are times when Charlie is very happy with you. I'm confident that there is a solution to this problem. The difficulty is working out what it is!

swampmaxmum · « **Reply #47 on:** January 07, 2009, 22:32:40 PM »

Based on Swampy's case, where he was an outdoor cat during the day for 18 months, until drama no 100 stopped that (stuck in a cellar for a week), I respectfully disagree with Peter Neville if he generalises. Yes, we had to get Max as company and yes, the first few months, or even 6 months I think, were tricky, but he ended up very happy, calmer and less stressed. It's not like you are leaving him unattended. The only potential problem I can see is that it may be tricky to get him another cat as a playmate. I definitely think that helps. But each cat is different and I'd say nothing's impossible with time and patience. I know it's so hard when he's so determined

I'd be wary of any behaviorist who has 'rules for cats' rather than treats each individually. I hope she can help you with suggestions and ideas that you haven't tried and that can work.

A wild & woolly tired thought, but what would Charlie make of a doggy companion? Could he pass on any lurgies to a dog or is it a mad idea as he hates dogs?

Liz · « **Reply #46 on:** January 07, 2009, 21:05:36 PM »

Have to say in our furry mob of 43 that a roaming cat can become an inside cat - we have 3 all ferals aged 14 and 8 and came here after being trapped nearly 6 months ago and none had tried to escape - housecats by my choice and they have fun in the house - no outside run for my housecats either

They seem to love looking out at the rain, snow and frost and then shut their eyes and go back to sleep - we had visitors who saw them in July 08 and they thought they looked rough and old and ready for the end - they nearly choked on these words on seeing them at new year they didn't think they were the same cats

Maddiesmum · « **Reply #45 on:** January 07, 2009, 18:54:35 PM »

Kate I have tried several times to video his behaviour but a) he moves so fast and b) it always comes out dark. However I am keeping a good if somewhat lengthy diary. I received the book Pav sent to me today written by Peter Neville (who in the past has advised Sarah Heath and who is credited in her book). One of the things he says is that a cat that has been used to free roaming cannot successfully be confined without it causing behavioural problems and that the cat should be rehomed to allow it free access again. I felt sick when I read it because I think it confirms my worst fears. Watching him outdoors you can almost see the yearning in him for the field and I feel such a heel depriving him. I just feel I have taken so much away from him in terms of his freedom and control and that no matter what I do it will not compensate. His urge for the field just seems to be getting stronger. I can't understand why it has flared up so suddenly though. Rambling again aren't I?

Gill (sneakiefeline) · « **Reply #44 on:** January 07, 2009, 18:38:16 PM »

I was thinking that too, about Charlie being angelic LOL.....he is the most handsome looking cat and nooooooooo way would I let him go. I am sure the behaviourist will be able to give some very basic stuff that all of us never thought of

swampmaxmum · « **Reply #43 on:** January 07, 2009, 18:23:12 PM »

have you got a video cam, even on your mobile or ordinary camera? The time I consulted a behaviourist for Max the Sprayer (no more since we moved), she wanted lots of video footage of his "bad" behaviour. It just may save some time (?). Or perhaps she can tell you before she comes around what she is going to need. Chances are of course when she comes, Charlie will be angelic.

Wibblechick · « **Reply #42 on:** January 07, 2009, 15:46:39 PM »

Well, that's something positive.

Fingers crossed, Sarah Heath may be able to help. In the meantime, here are some

to keep you going.

Maddiesmum · « **Reply #41 on:** January 07, 2009, 15:15:43 PM »

Vet just rang, she has done the referral so now I just have to wait for Sarah Heath to contact me.

Maddiesmum · « **Reply #40 on:** January 06, 2009, 15:27:07 PM »

LOL it's almost past. He is getting nervy again. Has been running in and out most of the day and trying to get to the field. Anyway has given up now and gone upstairs for a sleep. I think I will start a campaign to demolish the field.

swampmaxmum · « **Reply #39 on:** January 06, 2009, 14:21:01 PM »

Enjoy the moment xxxxx

Maddiesmum · « **Reply #38 on:** January 06, 2009, 14:12:28 PM »

LOL when spotted Kate. For once he is facing away from the field. He is desperately trying to escape the garden again and always at the field side. I think it is driving him nuts. However he is being his sweet Charlie which is lovely. Doubt it will last though.

swampmaxmum · « **Reply #37 on:** January 06, 2009, 14:04:30 PM »

I've just noticed Charlie's back - and Charlie's silhouette (very arty pic that) in the photo

bless him. Glad he's having a better day today. xxx

Maddiesmum · « **Reply #36 on:** January 06, 2009, 11:13:03 AM »

To be honest Sheryl not that we have sorted out the problem neighbour's cats by rehoming nine and having the others neutered, and two others have moved house there aren't as many cats around. He doesn't really mind seeing them walking round the fence or walls it is just when Sophie next door sits eyeballing him he gets worked up. He is out on his cat tree right now sitting upright watching the field and sniffing.

sheryl · « **Reply #35 on:** January 06, 2009, 10:54:11 AM »

So sorry to hear that you are having problems Hun.

Maybe its not so much the field but other cats that he can see. I dont have any advise but sending you love and hugs that you can get things sorted xxx

ems · « **Reply #34 on:** January 06, 2009, 10:47:54 AM »

Don't have nay constructive advice but just wanted to send

Fingers crossed for the behaviourist referral

Wibblechick · « **Reply #33 on:** January 06, 2009, 10:42:06 AM »

Keeping my fingers crossed for you and a :hug:to keep you going ...

Maddiesmum · « **Reply #32 on:** January 06, 2009, 10:39:18 AM »

Well thankfully today is a sweet Charlie day where he is mischievous and very very cuddly. I just adore him when he is like this he is such a pleasure. We just had a manic game of Da Mouse up and down the stairs and round the bedroom and he has gone into the garden for a furtle. I hope the field doesn't start calling to him again. Still waiting to hear from vet re behaviourist referral. Fingers crossed we can have a few calm days at least.

Maddiesmum · « **Reply #31 on:** January 05, 2009, 22:00:10 PM »

I don't want to put him through anything else right now as his anxiety etc is so high. I know at some stage in the not too distant future, if and when we can sort him out, then I will have the test done but I don't know what I will do if his levels have increased! I wish, in a way, I had never had him tested in the first place as I have had FIP in the back of my mind virtually every day since I got his result. My vet says it is highly unlikely and that he is a very healthy cat (apart from the behavioural side of things) in prime condition and she thinks he will probably have shed it. She offered to do his bloods last time I was there but I was just so OTT with worry that I couldn't face it. I would NEVER risk having another cat until I was 100% sure Charlie was clear. What does worry me though is that from what I have read stress is the biggest factor in pushing it over. That is, I think, why I get so anxious when Charlie is stressed. I might be being silly but I can't help it. Little sod has just been down and poked me for his supper and gone back upstairs to sleep now.

Millys Mum · « **Reply #30 on:** January 05, 2009, 20:13:05 PM »

Gill, theres no jab for it sadly.
Its very likely he is now a zero as most cats will shake it off and be done with it

if he still has a titre i dont think exposing a second cat to a carrier is the right way to go, it may not be lucky and be one if those who ends up mutating it.
With good hygeine in a single cat home you have a very good chance at ridding him of the virus

Maddiesmum · « **Reply #29 on:** January 05, 2009, 19:14:07 PM »

PS Can you spot the cat on the photo? Charlie with his back to the field for a moment

Gillian Harvey · « **Reply #28 on:** January 05, 2009, 19:10:57 PM »

Quote from: Maddiesmum on January 04, 2009, 21:31:54 PM

The vet said not to get another cat as Charlie could infect it and if it already had it there could be problems. I was too worked up when I was talking to her to take it in properly so this is something I will discuss with the behaviourist.

I think it would be a good idea to get bloods done again - otherwise you won't know if he continues to be a carrier of corona. Just because he had high titres when last tested, doesnt mean he will necessarilly be a carrier. Its likely, that if he's been well (physically) since he was first tested, that his titres are very low again now, or even zero - if so, he's no threat to another cat.

Hope Sara can help you - she's very good, from what I can tell through reading her books anyway.

Maddiesmum · « **Reply #27 on:** January 05, 2009, 18:45:32 PM »

Pav, yes please that would be wonderful as Peter Neville has advised Sarah Heath in the past - she has acknowledged his help in her book.

Kate - it would be difficult to say how long his behaviour lasts for because at the moment it is all the time he is awake. He has just knocked everything off the top of the freezer in the kitchen. An hour or so ago my daughter and her partner came round, he is well used to them and he flew out of the room backwards when my daughter walked across the room. His nervousness is very upsetting to see. I tried to keep him in this morning but he was really wanting to go out and I thought he might enjoy the snow (which he did) but he still sat on top of his cat tree which was covered in snow for quite a while watching the field. His interest in the field is intensifying by the day.

Not heard from the vet yet but she doesn't somedays as she does weekends. I know she will ring me as soon as she can. Thank you for caring during this difficult time for you and please don't worry about us, concentrate all your energies on Swampy xx

swampmaxmum · « **Reply #26 on:** January 05, 2009, 17:37:54 PM »

I can see how close the field must seem to him from your photo. Could you try keeping him totally indoors for a bit in this cold weather and see how he goes? The behaviorist may ask you to do that anyway as a test (?). He may yell a bit at first from frustration. If he plays all night, things can't be too bad - the vet today just told me to write down the length of time of any distressed or agitated behaviour compared to non agitated, as she reckons it's so horrible for owners (and cats) that we tend to think sometimes that it goes on for longer than it does.....you and I both can see if that makes any sense. sending lots of love to you both xx

pappilon · « **Reply #25 on:** January 05, 2009, 16:11:02 PM »

Oh Chrissie i am sorry you having problem with Charlie again, i do hope the behaviourist can help, i do have a book by Peter Neville called Do cats need shrinks? If you want i can send it to you and you can keep it as long as you want. It did help me understand Phoebe's behaviour a bit!
He is a cat Psychologist , you may find some thing usefull in the book to help with Charlie, let me know and i can put in post tomorrow.
Sending you a big

. X

Maddiesmum · « **Reply #24 on:** January 05, 2009, 11:15:04 AM »

I have taken a photo this morning so you can have a better idea re the proximity of the field to the house. It was taken from my back door and the field starts where the tall thin trees can be seen.

Dawn F · « **Reply #23 on:** January 05, 2009, 11:08:23 AM »

I've a book by Sarah Heath, I prefer her style tbh to other books I have read - take a deep breath and see what she says, you are doing everything you can

Author Topic: Continuing problems with Charlie UPDATED WITH PIC (Read 6884 times)